selecting 'Hide Contents' may crash MinimServer

[simoncn]

(14-08-2012 12:21)bubbleguuum Wrote:  

(14-08-2012 08:46)simoncn Wrote:  You are right that the server can send the evented ContainerUpdateIDs variable as a solution to this problem. Does BubbleDS support this evented variable and refresh its containers accordingly?

It doesn't but it really should. There's a manual reload action in the menu.

MinimServer currently doesn't send this evented variable. Because it's optional in the UPnP specification, I wasn't sure that any control points would be able to receive it. I've added it to the list of ideas for improvement in some future release.

[bubbleguuum]

(14-08-2012 23:21)simoncn Wrote:  

(14-08-2012 12:21)bubbleguuum Wrote:  

(14-08-2012 08:46)simoncn Wrote:  You are right that the server can send the evented ContainerUpdateIDs variable as a solution to this problem. Does BubbleDS support this evented variable and refresh its containers accordingly?

It doesn't but it really should. There's a manual reload action in the menu.

MinimServer currently doesn't send this evented variable. Because it's optional in the UPnP specification, I wasn't sure that any control points would be able to receive it. I've added it to the list of ideas for improvement in some future release.

1. Many CPs (including my own) may not subscribe to it
2. If a CP subscribe to it I'm not sure many Media Server implement this variable properly with meaningful values. I think at least WMP and Twonky do. That's probably one of the main reason I did not bother with it in the first place

[mikejazz]

(14-08-2012 12:32)simoncn Wrote:  I don't usually sit down and think "I want to play X". Normally I think "how about something from this composer and/or this artist, let's have a look at some options and choose one".

I also usually start to browse and direct myself to a Genre, then I like the system to help me choose.

I have a question regarding this.
Let's say I "want to play some Patricia Barber". So I navigate Genre "Jazz" > Artist "Patricia Barber". Here I find currently 5 containers:
- albuns
- items
- composer
- date
- style
OK, let's say I decide to narrow by composer. I find "Cole Porter" and find 11 items from 2 albuns of Patricia.

What if I now would like to use this Tag of Composer = Cole Porter, and wide open the selection to find all items where Cole Porter is the composer.

This is a nice feature of JRemote.

Do you also feel that this "drill-across" could be useful? Would it be complex to implement?
I see it as something similar to "Complete Album", but widening to all the database instead of only using the Album container.

This would be even more used in Classical; we might be interested to focus a search on a conductor, say "Haitink", drill down to "Bruckner", and from here, drill-across to discover all Bruckner in our library...

[winxi]

(16-08-2012 15:31)mikejazz Wrote:  This would be even more used in Classical; we might be interested to focus a search on a conductor, say "Haitink", drill down to "Bruckner", and from here, drill-across to discover all Bruckner in our library...

Hi, i think that this would be the job of a control point, presumed that UPnP search is available. As, for example with BubbleUPnP, you can directly jump to the corresponding complete album view from a title's context menu.

[simoncn]

(16-08-2012 15:31)mikejazz Wrote:  

(14-08-2012 12:32)simoncn Wrote:  I don't usually sit down and think "I want to play X". Normally I think "how about something from this composer and/or this artist, let's have a look at some options and choose one".

I also usually start to browse and direct myself to a Genre, then I like the system to help me choose.

I have a question regarding this.
Let's say I "want to play some Patricia Barber". So I navigate Genre "Jazz" > Artist "Patricia Barber". Here I find currently 5 containers:
- albuns
- items
- composer
- date
- style
OK, let's say I decide to narrow by composer. I find "Cole Porter" and find 11 items from 2 albuns of Patricia.

What if I now would like to use this Tag of Composer = Cole Porter, and wide open the selection to find all items where Cole Porter is the composer.

This is a nice feature of JRemote.

Do you also feel that this "drill-across" could be useful? Would it be complex to implement?
I see it as something similar to "Complete Album", but widening to all the database instead of only using the Album container.

This would be even more used in Classical; we might be interested to focus a search on a conductor, say "Haitink", drill down to "Bruckner", and from here, drill-across to discover all Bruckner in our library...

This was part of my initial vision for MinimServer, and I would really like to be able to do this when I'm browsing my collection.

Unfortunately, the UPnP protocol makes it practically impossible to do this on the server side, because each of these "drill-across" links would need to be represented as a further step down in the hierarchical tree of containers. However, it would be possible to implement something like this in the control point.

[mikejazz]

(16-08-2012 15:59)simoncn Wrote:  

(16-08-2012 15:31)mikejazz Wrote:  

(14-08-2012 12:32)simoncn Wrote:  I don't usually sit down and think "I want to play X". Normally I think "how about something from this composer and/or this artist, let's have a look at some options and choose one".

I also usually start to browse and direct myself to a Genre, then I like the system to help me choose.

I have a question regarding this.
Let's say I "want to play some Patricia Barber". So I navigate Genre "Jazz" > Artist "Patricia Barber". Here I find currently 5 containers:
- albuns
- items
- composer
- date
- style
OK, let's say I decide to narrow by composer. I find "Cole Porter" and find 11 items from 2 albuns of Patricia.

What if I now would like to use this Tag of Composer = Cole Porter, and wide open the selection to find all items where Cole Porter is the composer.

This is a nice feature of JRemote.

Do you also feel that this "drill-across" could be useful? Would it be complex to implement?
I see it as something similar to "Complete Album", but widening to all the database instead of only using the Album container.

This would be even more used in Classical; we might be interested to focus a search on a conductor, say "Haitink", drill down to "Bruckner", and from here, drill-across to discover all Bruckner in our library...

This was part of my initial vision for MinimServer, and I would really like to be able to do this when I'm browsing my collection.

Unfortunately, the UPnP protocol makes it practically impossible to do this on the server side, because each of these "drill-across" links would need to be represented as a further step down in the hierarchical tree of containers. However, it would be possible to implement something like this in the control point.

That is probably why there are control points that load all database to iPAD. I heard Aurender works like that. You can find information about that here:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/conten...er-review/

Simon, you are not in favor off this solution, I believe, because it would not follow UPNP AV architecture, right?

[simoncn]

(16-08-2012 16:45)mikejazz Wrote:  That is probably why there are control points that load all database to iPAD. I heard Aurender works like that. You can find information about that here:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/conten...er-review/

Simon, you are not in favor off this solution, I believe, because it would not follow UPNP AV architecture, right?

I think a UPnP control point should follow UPnP architecture when it's talking to a UPnP server. This doesn't mean that I think UPnP architecture is necessarily the only (or best) way to build a music playing system.

Aurender have built their own system that doesn't use UPnP. By doing that, they have been able to do what they think the user needs without being limited by what UPnP architecture supports. There's lots of room for innovation here, and there are other players doing similar thngs, such as Sooloos and J River. It would be great to have this kind of advanced functionality based on an open standard and an open protocol, but I don't see much prospect of that happening.

[mikejazz]

(16-08-2012 17:20)simoncn Wrote:  

(16-08-2012 16:45)mikejazz Wrote:  That is probably why there are control points that load all database to iPAD. I heard Aurender works like that. You can find information about that here:
http://www.computeraudiophile.com/conten...er-review/

Simon, you are not in favor off this solution, I believe, because it would not follow UPNP AV architecture, right?

I think a UPnP control point should follow UPnP architecture when it's talking to a UPnP server. This doesn't mean that I think UPnP architecture is necessarily the only (or best) way to build a music playing system.

Aurender have built their own system that doesn't use UPnP. By doing that, they have been able to do what they think the user needs without being limited by what UPnP architecture supports. There's lots of room for innovation here, and there are other players doing similar thngs, such as Sooloos and J River. It would be great to have this kind of advanced functionality based on an open standard and an open protocol, but I don't see much prospect of that happening.

Understood.

I tried Meridian control app on iPAD, connected to a Media Core 200, and thought it was my best experience in terms of ease of used combined with comprehensive information and rich metadata. It's still my reference.
Thanks for sharing these insights, now I understand better why some people discard uPNP.

On my network your MininServer combined with Songbook lite is giving an a very good experience.

[bbrip]

Wow, that Aurender iPad App looks really impressive. That would make a hell of a Control Point for Linn. Even beats Sooloos and makes Kinsky look like childs play

[mikejazz]

(16-08-2012 18:09)bbrip Wrote:  Wow, that Aurender iPad App looks really impressive. That would make a hell of a Control Point for Linn. Even beats Sooloos and makes Kinsky look like childs play

Like Sooloos, it's locked to it's own hardware.
I hope to try Aurender, one of these days. Then I could understand if it's better that Meridian...I was so impressed with Meridian I cannot take that conclusion just by looking at the CA demo.

Both are locked to their hardware and own media servers.