MinimServer and Simaudio Moon

[simoncn]

(27-10-2013 00:32)rmca99 Wrote:  Just to Clarify Moon Mind Qnap TS112 using an Ipad Mini, have gone through 2 complete installs and have the same problem as the above . The MInd app see MinimServer but the screen is blank,I sure could use the the ohnet fix ..Looking forward to using this

I have sent you a PM with a link to download a test build for QNAP ARM with this fix.

[rmca99]

(27-10-2013 16:15)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  [quote='rmca99' pid='5346' dateline='1382830341']
Just to Clarify Moon Mind Qnap TS112 using an Ipad Mini, have gone through 2 complete installs and have the same problem as the above . The MInd app see MinimServer but the screen is blank,I sure could use the the ohnet fix ..Looking forward to using this

I own a Moon 380D Neo, which embeds a Mind Streamer unit. I experienced the same problem when trying to access my music files from MinimServer through the Mind App. I did not care much about it, since I prefer using BubbleUPnP as a control point, with which MinimServer is no problem at all.

I revisited the issue after reading this thread. I found a workaround which may prove helpful for those whose prefer using the Mind App as a control point. Install the BubbleUPnP server on your server, go to the Media Servers tab, select MinimServer on the left pane, and in the right pane activate "Create a proxy Media Server on this LAN". In the Mind App, you should then be able to see a "MinimServer ... [proxy]" choice. Select it, and you should have no problem browsing your music. At least, that is what I experience, and MinimServer responds amazingly fast with this setup.

Regards
[/quo

Question does bubble work with Apple products ,,

[rmca99]

(27-10-2013 16:15)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  

(27-10-2013 00:32)rmca99 Wrote:  Just to Clarify Moon Mind Qnap TS112 using an Ipad Mini, have gone through 2 complete installs and have the same problem as the above . The MInd app see MinimServer but the screen is blank,I sure could use the the ohnet fix ..Looking forward to using this

I own a Moon 380D Neo, which embeds a Mind Streamer unit. I experienced the same problem when trying to access my music files from MinimServer through the Mind App. I did not care much about it, since I prefer using BubbleUPnP as a control point, with which MinimServer is no problem at all.

I revisited the issue after reading this thread. I found a workaround which may prove helpful for those whose prefer using the Mind App as a control point. Install the BubbleUPnP server on your server, go to the Media Servers tab, select MinimServer on the left pane, and in the right pane activate "Create a proxy Media Server on this LAN". In the Mind App, you should then be able to see a "MinimServer ... [proxy]" choice. Select it, and you should have no problem browsing your music. At least, that is what I experience, and MinimServer responds amazingly fast with this setup.

Regards

Tried to download the BubbleUpnp Qnap package but when clicking the link its just script ..Link to package must be broken

[Andre Gosselin]

(27-10-2013 16:15)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  

(27-10-2013 00:32)rmca99 Wrote:  Just to Clarify Moon Mind Qnap TS112 using an Ipad Mini, have gone through 2 complete installs and have the same problem as the above . The MInd app see MinimServer but the screen is blank,I sure could use the the ohnet fix ..Looking forward to using this

I own a Moon 380D Neo, which embeds a Mind Streamer unit. I experienced the same problem when trying to access my music files from MinimServer through the Mind App. I did not care much about it, since I prefer using BubbleUPnP as a control point, with which MinimServer is no problem at all.

I revisited the issue after reading this thread. I found a workaround which may prove helpful for those whose prefer using the Mind App as a control point. Install the BubbleUPnP server on your server, go to the Media Servers tab, select MinimServer on the left pane, and in the right pane activate "Create a proxy Media Server on this LAN". In the Mind App, you should then be able to see a "MinimServer ... [proxy]" choice. Select it, and you should have no problem browsing your music. At least, that is what I experience, and MinimServer responds amazingly fast with this setup.

Regards

Simon,
I am using MinimServer 0.72 as music server running on Win7, BubbleUPnP as control point on Android, and Simaudio Moon as renderer. Up to now, I never has any problem streaming my music with this setup. I today hit upon an album which simply wont play, the minimserver log showing random "Read timed out" when trying to stream tracks from it. If a apply the fix I suggested to make the "Moon app" work with minimserver and wrap MinimServer as an OpenHome renderer using BubbleUPnP server, everything works fine. Unfortunately doing so removes gapless playback capability from my renderer, a feature which for me is essential.

This thread mentions a fix for this problem with a temp MinimServer release. Is this fix available for Win7, and if so could you make it available to me ?

I have no idea why this problem occurs just for this album (I did many tests and could not find any other one). I know that my Win7 received a lot of system updates in the last few days, maybe the cause resides there. I could send you logs if this may help you.

Thanks for you help

[simoncn]

(27-11-2013 21:19)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  Simon,
I am using MinimServer 0.72 as music server running on Win7, BubbleUPnP as control point on Android, and Simaudio Moon as renderer. Up to now, I never has any problem streaming my music with this setup. I today hit upon an album which simply wont play, the minimserver log showing random "Read timed out" when trying to stream tracks from it. If a apply the fix I suggested to make the "Moon app" work with minimserver and wrap MinimServer as an OpenHome renderer using BubbleUPnP server, everything works fine. Unfortunately doing so removes gapless playback capability from my renderer, a feature which for me is essential.

This thread mentions a fix for this problem with a temp MinimServer release. Is this fix available for Win7, and if so could you make it available to me ?

I have no idea why this problem occurs just for this album (I did many tests and could not find any other one). I know that my Win7 received a lot of system updates in the last few days, maybe the cause resides there. I could send you logs if this may help you.

Thanks for you help

This isn't the same problem that has been discussed earlier in this thread. The problem that was discussed and needs the test build occurs only with the MOON MiND app as control point, but you are using BubbleUPnP as the control point.

I don't recall ever seeing "read timed out" messages in the MinimServer log. Please post a short extract from the MinimServer log that shows these messages.

[Andre Gosselin]

(27-11-2013 21:50)simoncn Wrote:  

(27-11-2013 21:19)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  Simon,
I am using MinimServer 0.72 as music server running on Win7, BubbleUPnP as control point on Android, and Simaudio Moon as renderer. Up to now, I never has any problem streaming my music with this setup. I today hit upon an album which simply wont play, the minimserver log showing random "Read timed out" when trying to stream tracks from it. If a apply the fix I suggested to make the "Moon app" work with minimserver and wrap MinimServer as an OpenHome renderer using BubbleUPnP server, everything works fine. Unfortunately doing so removes gapless playback capability from my renderer, a feature which for me is essential.

This thread mentions a fix for this problem with a temp MinimServer release. Is this fix available for Win7, and if so could you make it available to me ?

I have no idea why this problem occurs just for this album (I did many tests and could not find any other one). I know that my Win7 received a lot of system updates in the last few days, maybe the cause resides there. I could send you logs if this may help you.

Thanks for you help

This isn't the same problem that has been discussed earlier in this thread. The problem that was discussed and needs the test build occurs only with the MOON MiND app as control point, but you are using BubbleUPnP as the control point.

I don't recall ever seeing "read timed out" messages in the MinimServer log. Please post a short extract from the MinimServer log that shows these messages.

Simon,
I have attached a log file, produced with MinimServer logging level set to Trace. The log covers the steps:
-starting BubbleUPnP
-selecting MinimServer (Moon Mind already selected)
- browsing AlbumArtist -> "Ashkenazy, Vladimir"
- browsing albums -> "Favourite Chopin"
- enquing all tracks of the album

Tapping first track ("101 Chopin: polonaise in A major...") succeeded this time, but usually the track does not stream at all or plays for just a few seconds and I then get the same error as for the other two.

Selecting 2nd track ("102 Chopin: Prelude in D flat major ...") does not play and I get a "Read timed out" message.

Ditto for 3rd track ("103 Chopin: Waltz in D flat major ..."), which gives a timed out message.

Thnks for your help.

[simoncn]

(27-11-2013 22:47)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  Simon,
I have attached a log file, produced with MinimServer logging level set to Trace. The log covers the steps:
-starting BubbleUPnP
-selecting MinimServer (Moon Mind already selected)
- browsing AlbumArtist -> "Ashkenazy, Vladimir"
- browsing albums -> "Favourite Chopin"
- enquing all tracks of the album

Tapping first track ("101 Chopin: polonaise in A major...") succeeded this time, but usually the track does not stream at all or plays for just a few seconds and I then get the same error as for the other two.

Selecting 2nd track ("102 Chopin: Prelude in D flat major ...") does not play and I get a "Read timed out" message.

Ditto for 3rd track ("103 Chopin: Waltz in D flat major ..."), which gives a timed out message.

Thnks for your help.

This looks like a renderer bug, possibly caused by some data in the file that the renderer can't handle.

In the failing scenario, the renderer sends a valid HTTP GET request with the 'Connection: close' header (lines 823/824). This header means the renderer shouldn't send any more requests on the same connection after the current request has completed. MinimServer streams the response to this request. After MinimServer has finished streaming the data (line 1129), the renderer sends another incomplete malformed request on the same connection (line 1130) containing this data:

Wed Nov 27 16:24:03

The contents of this invalid request are written to the log by MinimServer at the start of line 1130. MinimServer rejects this invalid request and aborts the connection (lines 1131 to 1133).

[Andre Gosselin]

(27-11-2013 23:28)simoncn Wrote:  

(27-11-2013 22:47)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  Simon,
I have attached a log file, produced with MinimServer logging level set to Trace. The log covers the steps:
-starting BubbleUPnP
-selecting MinimServer (Moon Mind already selected)
- browsing AlbumArtist -> "Ashkenazy, Vladimir"
- browsing albums -> "Favourite Chopin"
- enquing all tracks of the album

Tapping first track ("101 Chopin: polonaise in A major...") succeeded this time, but usually the track does not stream at all or plays for just a few seconds and I then get the same error as for the other two.

Selecting 2nd track ("102 Chopin: Prelude in D flat major ...") does not play and I get a "Read timed out" message.

Ditto for 3rd track ("103 Chopin: Waltz in D flat major ..."), which gives a timed out message.

Thnks for your help.

This looks like a renderer bug, possibly caused by some data in the file that the renderer can't handle.

In the failing scenario, the renderer sends a valid HTTP GET request with the 'Connection: close' header (lines 823/824). This header means the renderer shouldn't send any more requests on the same connection after the current request has completed. MinimServer streams the response to this request. After MinimServer has finished streaming the data (line 1129), the renderer sends another incomplete malformed request on the same connection (line 1130) containing this data:

Wed Nov 27 16:24:03

The contents of this invalid request are written to the log by MinimServer at the start of line 1130. MinimServer rejects this invalid request and aborts the connection (lines 1131 to 1133).

Simon,
Many thanks for having taken time to research this issue. Can I ask a few more questions ?
I mentionned in my opening post that creating an OpenHome renderer for the Simaudio Moon renderer through BubbleUPnP server makes the problem disappear. Also, I did not mention that serving the album through the MediaMonkey server (without any transcoding or DSP effects) also works. Do you have any idea of what those 2 softwares do in that case ? Could it be that they implement a bit more "tolerance" when facing illegal or malformed requests, and could'nt such an approach benefit MinimServer and increase its appeal as the best music server ?

I remember the ugly time when we had to face DRM protected music. When peering at the album cover, I see "ADRM" below the London
logo (see attachment). I tried to research the meaning of the ADRM mention, and I am unable to tell wether it has anything to do with DRM. Do you have any idea about that, and could this format (if indeed it is one) be at the heart of my problem ?

Thanks again

[simoncn]

(28-11-2013 00:54)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  Simon,
Many thanks for having taken time to research this issue. Can I ask a few more questions ?
I mentionned in my opening post that creating an OpenHome renderer for the Simaudio Moon renderer through BubbleUPnP server makes the problem disappear. Also, I did not mention that serving the album through the MediaMonkey server (without any transcoding or DSP effects) also works. Do you have any idea of what those 2 softwares do in that case ? Could it be that they implement a bit more "tolerance" when facing illegal or malformed requests, and could'nt such an approach benefit MinimServer and increase its appeal as the best music server ?

I think it's unlikely that another server could handle this error any better than MinimServer is doing. From looking at the log again, it seems that the output stream from MinimServer to the renderer was interrupted by a SocketException at the same time that the malformed request was sent (lines 1129 and 1131). No server would be able to recover from this output stream error.

Given that the problem doesn't occur with the BubbleUPnP OpenHome renderer or MediaMonkey, there is probably some difference in how the OpenHome renderer and MediaMonkey set up the streaming connection to the renderer, and this difference is somehow avoiding the renderer problem. To understand this difference, I would need to see full Wireshark traces for both the working and the failing scenarios.

For the failing case, you would need to run Wireshark on the Windows machine that is hosting MinimServer. For the working case, you would need to run the OpenHome renderer or MediaMonkey on a Windows machine, and run Wireshark on this Windows machine.

In both cases, you would need to start the WireShark trace before the renderer sends the Browse request for the failing track that will be played. For the working case, you can stop the Wireshark trace as soon as the music starts to play. For the failing case, you need to leave the Wireshark trace running until the renderer sends the malformed request, which is about 25 seconds after the request to play the track.

These WireShark traces will be too large to attach to a forum post, so you'll need to upload them to my FTP server.

Quote:I remember the ugly time when we had to face DRM protected music. When peering at the album cover, I see "ADRM" below the London
logo (see attachment). I tried to research the meaning of the ADRM mention, and I am unable to tell wether it has anything to do with DRM. Do you have any idea about that, and could this format (if indeed it is one) be at the heart of my problem ?

Thanks again

Your post doesn't contain an attachment. When adding an attachment, you need to select the attachment file and then click the "Add Attachment" button on the right. If you don't click the button, nothing will be attached.

Please can you also upload one of the failing files to my FTP server. I will look at the file to see if there is anything unusual about it.

[Andre Gosselin]

(28-11-2013 09:25)simoncn Wrote:  

(28-11-2013 00:54)Andre Gosselin Wrote:  Simon,
Many thanks for having taken time to research this issue. Can I ask a few more questions ?
I mentionned in my opening post that creating an OpenHome renderer for the Simaudio Moon renderer through BubbleUPnP server makes the problem disappear. Also, I did not mention that serving the album through the MediaMonkey server (without any transcoding or DSP effects) also works. Do you have any idea of what those 2 softwares do in that case ? Could it be that they implement a bit more "tolerance" when facing illegal or malformed requests, and could'nt such an approach benefit MinimServer and increase its appeal as the best music server ?

I think it's unlikely that another server could handle this error any better than MinimServer is doing. From looking at the log again, it seems that the output stream from MinimServer to the renderer was interrupted by a SocketException at the same time that the malformed request was sent (lines 1129 and 1131). No server would be able to recover from this output stream error.

Given that the problem doesn't occur with the BubbleUPnP OpenHome renderer or MediaMonkey, there is probably some difference in how the OpenHome renderer and MediaMonkey set up the streaming connection to the renderer, and this difference is somehow avoiding the renderer problem. To understand this difference, I would need to see full Wireshark traces for both the working and the failing scenarios.

For the failing case, you would need to run Wireshark on the Windows machine that is hosting MinimServer. For the working case, you would need to run the OpenHome renderer or MediaMonkey on a Windows machine, and run Wireshark on this Windows machine.

In both cases, you would need to start the WireShark trace before the renderer sends the Browse request for the failing track that will be played. For the working case, you can stop the Wireshark trace as soon as the music starts to play. For the failing case, you need to leave the Wireshark trace running until the renderer sends the malformed request, which is about 25 seconds after the request to play the track.

These WireShark traces will be too large to attach to a forum post, so you'll need to upload them to my FTP server.

Quote:I remember the ugly time when we had to face DRM protected music. When peering at the album cover, I see "ADRM" below the London
logo (see attachment). I tried to research the meaning of the ADRM mention, and I am unable to tell wether it has anything to do with DRM. Do you have any idea about that, and could this format (if indeed it is one) be at the heart of my problem ?

Thanks again

Your post doesn't contain an attachment. When adding an attachment, you need to select the attachment file and then click the "Add Attachment" button on the right. If you don't click the button, nothing will be attached.

Please can you also upload one of the failing files to my FTP server. I will look at the file to see if there is anything unusual about it.

Thanks, files have been sent.