Group tag

[stefano_mbp]

Hi Simon,
new GROUP tag functionalities are welcome (finally) but I have a issue.
Sometimes I use two values to describe a work:
1) the actual work
2) a “work grouping” value
An example can describe the 2) case:
we can find Bruckner’s symphonies from different “editions” like Nowak, Haas, Carragan and other
In this case I use two values where one describes the “generic” work description and the other the work according to the specific “edition” (see the attached screenshot)
For these “particular” cases unfortunately the scan log reports a warning error for the second value found in GROUP tag:
Warning: conflicting GROUP tag value ……
The question is: would it be possible to allow multiple values (maybe two at least) in Group tag?
Thank you

[simoncn]

Group is a structural/containment tag like Album and Disc. Albums contain tracks, discs or groups; discs contain tracks or groups; groups contain tracks. Having two values in the Group tag for a track would mean the track belongs to two different groups, which is not possible (just as a track cannot belong to two different discs or two different albums). You would either need to use some other tag (such as Edition) to hold the additional metadata or combine work and edition information into a single GROUP value.

[stefano_mbp]

Thanks.

[stefano_mbp]

Hi Simon, I have another question/issue about using Group tag.
In Lumïn app it seems that the Album name/title is lost when Group tag is not empty.
No issues when I browse by Lumïn “Folder browsing” that is the UPNP direct browsing mode, but when I browse by Album title, using then the internal app db, I actually find only Groups name and the Album title is gone.
This seems confirmed by checking tracks details where the Album title is overwritten by Group name.

This happens using Linn app too.
Is this behavior “normal” or is it due to a bug in the Lumïn and Linn apps or in how Minimserver communicate details to the apps?
Thank you

[stefano_mbp]

… and this screenshot is from Linn app

[stefano_mbp]

… one more issue using Group tag is that in both Lumïn and Linn app the track count drastically decreases from more or less 192000 to more or less 75000 … but in the log the item count (using and not using the Group tag) is the same.
Something is definitely going wrong ….

[simoncn]

(12-06-2024 11:26)stefano_mbp Wrote:  Hi Simon, I have another question/issue about using Group tag.
In Lumïn app it seems that the Album name/title is lost when Group tag is not empty.
No issues when I browse by Lumïn “Folder browsing” that is the UPNP direct browsing mode, but when I browse by Album title, using then the internal app db, I actually find only Groups name and the Album title is gone.
This seems confirmed by checking tracks details where the Album title is overwritten by Group name.

This happens using Linn app too.
Is this behavior “normal” or is it due to a bug in the Lumïn and Linn apps or in how Minimserver communicate details to the apps?
Thank you

In the DIDL-Lite metadata sent by MinimServer to the control point, a Group is represented by a musicAlbum container contained within the musicAlbum container for the album. This case of a sub-album within a top-level album is explicitly permitted by the UPnP specification.

MinimServer uses the group name as the name of the sub-album and the album name as the name of the top-level album. This means that both the album name and the group name are available when using standard UPnP browsing. Using the group name as the name of the sub-album enables most control points to show the group name on the Now Playing screen when playing tracks within the group (see the discussion in this thread). The Linn app track information display is using only the values it finds in the track metadata and this is why are seeing the group name in the Album field for tracks that are grouped.

The situation with the Albums section of the LUMIN app is different. The LUMIN app reads DIDL-Lite metadata for all tracks and creates its own client-side database from this track metadata. Because the track metadata for a grouped track doesn't include the album name, the LUMIN app would need to follow the UPnP parent/child hierarchy to find the top-level album containing the track.

A possible workaround would be to use this tagFormat setting:

Group.displayFormat={$group^$album^: }

With this setting, the DIDL-Lite name of the group sub-album would be "group name: album name" and this name would be shown as the album name of a grouped track in track information, By Folder browsing and the LUMIN album list.

(12-06-2024 15:30)stefano_mbp Wrote:  … one more issue using Group tag is that in both Lumïn and Linn app the track count drastically decreases from more or less 192000 to more or less 75000 … but in the log the item count (using and not using the Group tag) is the same.
Something is definitely going wrong ….

Please clarify your comment about the track count decreasing when the Group tag is enabled. Where do you see this value in the Linn app? I have looked everywhere I can think of and I don't see it. In the LUMIN app, I see a "Song: xxx" value but this value is the same whether or not the Group tag is enabled. The MinimServer log shows the number of audio files and this number doesn't change when some files are grouped.

[stefano_mbp]

(13-06-2024 20:42)simoncn Wrote:  Please clarify your comment about the track count decreasing when the Group tag is enabled. Where do you see this value in the Linn app? I have looked everywhere I can think of and I don't see it. In the LUMIN app, I see a "Song: xxx" value but this value is the same whether or not the Group tag is enabled. The MinimServer log shows the number of audio files and this number doesn't change when some files are grouped.

When Group tag is enabled then browsing by Lumïn “Folder browsing” at the first level (the initial one) the tracks count is lower (red arrow in the screenshot) then without enabling Group (green arrow)
The same is using Linn app

[stefano_mbp]

(13-06-2024 20:42)simoncn Wrote:  A possible workaround would be to use this tagFormat setting:

Group.displayFormat={$group^$album^: }

With this setting, the DIDL-Lite name of the group sub-album would be "group name: album name" and this name would be shown as the album name of a grouped track in track information, By Folder browsing and the LUMIN album list.

Thanks, I’ll try with your suggestion and report back

[simoncn]

(13-06-2024 21:33)stefano_mbp Wrote:  When Group tag is enabled then browsing by Lumïn “Folder browsing” at the first level (the initial one) the tracks count is lower (red arrow in the screenshot) then without enabling Group (green arrow)
The same is using Linn app

This is an item count, not a track count. Each group is counted as one item, no matter how many tracks are in the group. The item count is computed by MinimServer, so it will be the same with all control points.