Best client for macOS / iOS?

[simoncn]

I like Glider but it has the disadvantage (when used with MinimServer) of using its own browse tree instead of the "intelligent browsing" tree that MinimServer sends to the UPnP control point.

[lafuente]

On ios I like Arcam music life. It’s freéand can accomodate any renderer.

There is also Lumin, but it only operate with open home hardware

[lyapounov]

(15-02-2019 20:43)simoncn Wrote:  

(15-02-2019 13:21)timster Wrote:  I think it does actually. The core would sit on the Mac, as would the control. He can point roon to his NAS and hey presto. I think it would even play on the Mac.

Isn't the Roon core a very large and heavy turning wheel?

I am trying Roon right now on my Synology. It is a proprietary system which does accepts the Mac as a renderer (I tested, it works). The closest on a synology would be DS-Audio.

What Roon offers is 1) a better tagging of your content (though I have not checked how better it is) by creating its own database without changing the files, 2) a navigation system to your library, 3) a streamer, 4) access to booklet and more images if it exists, 5) connection to other contents, in order to propose (through their app only) some kind of "intelligent" browsing, like artists related to the music you are listening, etc.. A little bit like the Qobuz app, but supposed to be more "intelligent".

What I don't like in Roon is: 1) they don't propose a folder based navigation (Simon, thank so much for this), 2) no way to upscale (Simon, thank you again), and 3) their price $100+ per year, or $500+ one shot, which I don't find the value for, but they seem to have customers, so what can I say (Simon, etc... :-)

I have had some hot exchange with the creator of Roon. He basically told me that folder browsing was a stupid demand, because his browsing was so much better (I was the stupid one demanding this, which is very important for me).

How can one possibly sell something so expensive when one just doesn't care about one's potential customers is a mystery to me. I thought only sect leaders were able to do this...

Thanks one more time, Simon, to be so much listening to your users !!!

And to answer the initial question: I am lucky enough to have downloaded PlugPlayer on Mac, which accepts the Mac as a renderer, before the programmer shut down his web site, and made the app unavailable..

[paultaylor]

(25-02-2019 03:27)lyapounov Wrote:  What Roon offers is 1) a better tagging of your content (though I have not checked how better it is) by creating its own database without changing the files, 2) a navigation system to your library, 3) a streamer, 4) access to booklet and more images if it exists, 5) connection to other contents, in order to propose (through their app only) some kind of "intelligent" browsing, like artists related to the music you are listening, etc.. A little bit like the Qobuz app, but supposed to be more "intelligent".

What I don't like in Roon is: 1) they don't propose a folder based navigation (Simon, thank so much for this), 2) no way to upscale (Simon, thank you again), and 3) their price $100+ per year, or $500+ one shot, which I don't find the value for, but they seem to have customers, so what can I say (Simon, etc... :-)

I have had some hot exchange with the creator of Roon. He basically told me that folder browsing was a stupid demand, because his browsing was so much better (I was the stupid one demanding this, which is very important for me).

I agree, if your metadata was all correct and complete then maybe browsing by folder would never be necessary, but even then it is still useful because sometimes you can remember what something is originally called and where it is but not be sure of the metadata. For example I had a customer who had a series albums under Frank Zappa, but some were correctly credited to Mothers of Invention, so the metadata didnt match the browser tree and he treated it all as Frank Zappa.

Roons intelligent browsing is quite good, but uses alot of resource and removes control from you as the customer. (Okay Im biased) Personally I feel it is better to get the metadata fixed properly in the files themselves, then serve the information that you are interested in via a flexible server such as MinimServer. The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

[simoncn]

(25-02-2019 14:41)paultaylor Wrote:  The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

Can you expand on this? My preferred control points are Kinsky (Windows) and BubbleUPnP (Android). What is missing from these that you would like to see added?

[lyapounov]

(25-02-2019 21:56)simoncn Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 14:41)paultaylor Wrote:  The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

Can you expand on this? My preferred control points are Kinsky (Windows) and BubbleUPnP (Android). What is missing from these that you would like to see added?

I have issues with BubbleUPnP in terms of ergonomy, but "de gustibus et coloribus non est discutandum" :-)

On IoS, for me, nothing beats the Lumin app, which I find the clearer, the most agreable; much more than kinsky or kazoo. It just lacks the booklet browsing :-)

[lyapounov]

(25-02-2019 14:41)paultaylor Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 03:27)lyapounov Wrote:  What Roon offers is 1) a better tagging of your content (though I have not checked how better it is) by creating its own database without changing the files, 2) a navigation system to your library, 3) a streamer, 4) access to booklet and more images if it exists, 5) connection to other contents, in order to propose (through their app only) some kind of "intelligent" browsing, like artists related to the music you are listening, etc.. A little bit like the Qobuz app, but supposed to be more "intelligent".

What I don't like in Roon is: 1) they don't propose a folder based navigation (Simon, thank so much for this), 2) no way to upscale (Simon, thank you again), and 3) their price $100+ per year, or $500+ one shot, which I don't find the value for, but they seem to have customers, so what can I say (Simon, etc... :-)

I have had some hot exchange with the creator of Roon. He basically told me that folder browsing was a stupid demand, because his browsing was so much better (I was the stupid one demanding this, which is very important for me).

I agree, if your metadata was all correct and complete then maybe browsing by folder would never be necessary, but even then it is still useful because sometimes you can remember what something is originally called and where it is but not be sure of the metadata. For example I had a customer who had a series albums under Frank Zappa, but some were correctly credited to Mothers of Invention, so the metadata didnt match the browser tree and he treated it all as Frank Zappa.

Roons intelligent browsing is quite good, but uses alot of resource and removes control from you as the customer. (Okay Im biased) Personally I feel it is better to get the metadata fixed properly in the files themselves, then serve the information that you are interested in via a flexible server such as MinimServer. The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

I agree with you, Paul; and by the way, I always promess to myself I will get your brilliant app ! Lack of time... I have now 6000+ albums, and I can tell you that the tagging is a nightmare. I would say that 80% is to re-tag, but there are all on a synology, with no direct network access except sftp...

[Alandbush]

(26-02-2019 01:12)lyapounov Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 14:41)paultaylor Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 03:27)lyapounov Wrote:  What Roon offers is 1) a better tagging of your content (though I have not checked how better it is) by creating its own database without changing the files, 2) a navigation system to your library, 3) a streamer, 4) access to booklet and more images if it exists, 5) connection to other contents, in order to propose (through their app only) some kind of "intelligent" browsing, like artists related to the music you are listening, etc.. A little bit like the Qobuz app, but supposed to be more "intelligent".

What I don't like in Roon is: 1) they don't propose a folder based navigation (Simon, thank so much for this), 2) no way to upscale (Simon, thank you again), and 3) their price $100+ per year, or $500+ one shot, which I don't find the value for, but they seem to have customers, so what can I say (Simon, etc... :-)

I have had some hot exchange with the creator of Roon. He basically told me that folder browsing was a stupid demand, because his browsing was so much better (I was the stupid one demanding this, which is very important for me).

I agree, if your metadata was all correct and complete then maybe browsing by folder would never be necessary, but even then it is still useful because sometimes you can remember what something is originally called and where it is but not be sure of the metadata. For example I had a customer who had a series albums under Frank Zappa, but some were correctly credited to Mothers of Invention, so the metadata didnt match the browser tree and he treated it all as Frank Zappa.

Roons intelligent browsing is quite good, but uses alot of resource and removes control from you as the customer. (Okay Im biased) Personally I feel it is better to get the metadata fixed properly in the files themselves, then serve the information that you are interested in via a flexible server such as MinimServer. The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

I agree with you, Paul; and by the way, I always promess to myself I will get your brilliant app ! Lack of time... I have now 6000+ albums, and I can tell you that the tagging is a nightmare. I would say that 80% is to re-tag, but there are all on a synology, with no direct network access except sftp...

If you are running Roon on your NAS, that suggests it’s an Intel cpu, in which case SongKong might also be capable of running on the NAS.
Check out this List of compatible Synology devices.

[lyapounov]

(26-02-2019 01:41)Alandbush Wrote:  

(26-02-2019 01:12)lyapounov Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 14:41)paultaylor Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 03:27)lyapounov Wrote:  What Roon offers is 1) a better tagging of your content (though I have not checked how better it is) by creating its own database without changing the files, 2) a navigation system to your library, 3) a streamer, 4) access to booklet and more images if it exists, 5) connection to other contents, in order to propose (through their app only) some kind of "intelligent" browsing, like artists related to the music you are listening, etc.. A little bit like the Qobuz app, but supposed to be more "intelligent".

What I don't like in Roon is: 1) they don't propose a folder based navigation (Simon, thank so much for this), 2) no way to upscale (Simon, thank you again), and 3) their price $100+ per year, or $500+ one shot, which I don't find the value for, but they seem to have customers, so what can I say (Simon, etc... :-)

I have had some hot exchange with the creator of Roon. He basically told me that folder browsing was a stupid demand, because his browsing was so much better (I was the stupid one demanding this, which is very important for me).

I agree, if your metadata was all correct and complete then maybe browsing by folder would never be necessary, but even then it is still useful because sometimes you can remember what something is originally called and where it is but not be sure of the metadata. For example I had a customer who had a series albums under Frank Zappa, but some were correctly credited to Mothers of Invention, so the metadata didnt match the browser tree and he treated it all as Frank Zappa.

Roons intelligent browsing is quite good, but uses alot of resource and removes control from you as the customer. (Okay Im biased) Personally I feel it is better to get the metadata fixed properly in the files themselves, then serve the information that you are interested in via a flexible server such as MinimServer. The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

I agree with you, Paul; and by the way, I always promess to myself I will get your brilliant app ! Lack of time... I have now 6000+ albums, and I can tell you that the tagging is a nightmare. I would say that 80% is to re-tag, but there are all on a synology, with no direct network access except sftp...

If you are running Roon on your NAS, that suggests it’s an Intel cpu, in which case SongKong might also be capable of running on the NAS.
Check out this List of compatible Synology devices.

Ah yes, I remember, this what I should have done. Yes, I have a ds418play ... Will try songkong ! thx Alan

[paultaylor]

(25-02-2019 21:56)simoncn Wrote:  

(25-02-2019 14:41)paultaylor Wrote:  The trouble is at the moment I don't feel there is a UPNP control point that really does justice to the information that can be served via a UPNP server.

Can you expand on this? My preferred control points are Kinsky (Windows) and BubbleUPnP (Android). What is missing from these that you would like to see added?

I find all of them just incredibly ugly, a series of lists that you can navigate but nothing is clever done, i,e a list of albums is treated exactly the same as a list of composers ectera, whereas Roon does look nice.

The main things missing for me are:
Artist Images (extend to composer, conductor ectera)
Making use of urls, if server send a wikipedia release url would be nice to see the contents of that url within the contol point.
In general dealing with the data more intelligently