MinimServer complexity (was Configuration Backup)

[Dieter Stockert]

(29-09-2014 15:00)DavidHB Wrote:  In my experience, 'non-technical' is more often an issue of attitude or confidence than of actual capability.

Yes, I agree (at least for my person that's true). For me it's alright if I have to do a lot of learning with Photoshop or InDesign or FileMaker, to get good results. But I think it's not alright with a music server.

[simoncn]

(29-09-2014 19:28)Dieter Stockert Wrote:  Yes, I agree (at least for my person that's true). For me it's alright if I have to do a lot of learning with Photoshop or InDesign or FileMaker, to get good results. But I think it's not alright with a music server.

Is this because there are music servers that give you what you want without the need for learning? I haven't found one yet.

[Dieter Stockert]

(29-09-2014 19:48)simoncn Wrote:  Is this because there are music servers that give you what you want without the need for learning?

No. The only two I know are Twonky (which was pre-installed on my QNAP NAS) and MinimServer (which I use since it was available - I will never go back to Twonky!).

[DavidHB]

I am posting as a matter of courtesy, to make it clear that I think I've said my piece on this. Simon and I agree that our respective points are valid, but that does leave unanswered the question of how 'technical' a MinimServer user should be a expected to be.

To a geek like me, learning the 'technical' aspects of the program is all part of the fun. I doubt that I am typical in this respect. MinimServer is such a clever and useful program that I feel that as wide an audience as possible should share in its benefits.

I haven't tried Asset or Twonky (though I have used the former on a dealer's system), but nothing in their descriptions on the web tempts me to try them as an alternative to MinimServer. So I hope that over time, the MinimServer learning curve can be made less steep, and ways can be found both to tempt new users in and to make opinion formers - especially dealers - more aware of and prepared to recommend MinimServer as an alternative to what I believe are less capable products.

David

[simoncn]

(01-10-2014 10:59)DavidHB Wrote:  I am posting as a matter of courtesy, to make it clear that I think I've said my piece on this. Simon and I agree that our respective points are valid, but that does leave unanswered the question of how 'technical' a MinimServer user should be a expected to be.

To a geek like me, learning the 'technical' aspects of the program is all part of the fun. I doubt that I am typical in this respect. MinimServer is such a clever and useful program that I feel that as wide an audience as possible should share in its benefits.

I haven't tried Asset or Twonky (though I have used the former on a dealer's system), but nothing in their descriptions on the web tempts me to try them as an alternative to MinimServer. So I hope that over time, the MinimServer learning curve can be made less steep, and ways can be found both to tempt new users in and to make opinion formers - especially dealers - more aware of and prepared to recommend MinimServer as an alternative to what I believe are less capable products.

David

I'd like to make it clear that I consider the current situation unsatisfactory and in need of improvement. It should be as simple to rip and play digital audio files as it is to play a CD, and this goal seems further away now than when I first started work on MinimServer.

From a server perspective, there are two main issues: the diversity of tagging approaches and the diversity of control points and renderers. Control point diversity is increasing rapidly as each renderer manufacturer brings out their own dedicated control point app. These apps are often buggy and don't provide a satisfactory user experience, so users ask for server-side tweaks to compensate for control point deficiencies. In addition, each control point app seems to handle the XML data sent by MinimServer in a slightly different way, which requires a further set of server-side tweaks to adapt this XML to suit different control points. There are renderer issues as well, with some renderers having technical issues with playing internet radio streams that require yet more server-side tweaks to fix. Finaly, different tagging approaches and different browsing preferences introduce yet another dimension where server-side tweaks are required to provide the desired indexing and browsing experience.

I have tried to accommodate this diversity by adding options to MinimServer. As a result, the externals and internals of MinimServer have become increasingly complex, which creates issues with usability and maintainability.

Some manufacturers are solving the complexity issue by building a complete stack of hardware and software components themselves. Apple is a prime example and others like Naim and Linn are following their example.

For users who don't want to commit to using a suite of products from a single manufacturer, I think the only way the complexity problem can be solved is by industry convergence in areas such as tagging schemes, server functionality, control point functionality and renderer functionality. Previous attempts to do this such as UPnP and DLNA haven't been very successful because they have standardised lower-level protocols but haven't addressed higher-level issues such as how to tag and view a multidisc album, how to tag and view track artists and album artists, or how to play an internet radio stream (just a few examples).

I would love to propose a solution to this but I don't have one at the moment. I would be very interested to hear the thoughts and opinions of the MinimServer user community.

Because the title of this thread doesn't reflect the way the discussion is now going, I am renaming it to "MinimServer complexity (was Configuration Backup)" to try to get more people engaged.