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Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - Printable Version

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Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - winxi - 14-04-2013 01:44

Hi,

there seems to be an inconsistency when applying Album.displayFormat in that multi-disc albums with the same name but being in different folders are merged although mergeFolderAlbums is set to false. Let me give an example:

Lets say that we have two albums named albumA and albumB, where albumA is a single-disc album and albumB is a multi-disc album. Both of the albums are stored as FLAC and as MP3 in different folders each. So we have the four folders albumA_mp3, albumA_flac, albumB_mp3 and albumB_flac.

By default, the following album list will be shown by MinimServer in a control point:
albumA
albumA
albumB
albumB

When applying Album.displayFormat in the tagFormat property to indicate the file format in the album list, e.g.

Code:
Album.displayFormat={$album^$#AudioFormat^ [^]}

MinimServer will show the following list with the merged MP3 and FLAC instances of the multi-disc album albumB:
albumA [MP3]
albumA [FLAC]
albumB [MP3, FLAC]

The expected album list would be:
albumA [MP3]
albumA [FLAC]
albumB [MP3]
albumB [FLAC]


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - simoncn - 14-04-2013 16:10

(14-04-2013 01:44)winxi Wrote:  MinimServer will show the following list with the merged MP3 and FLAC instances of the multi-disc album albumB:
albumA [MP3]
albumA [FLAC]
albumB [MP3, FLAC]

The expected album list would be:
albumA [MP3]
albumA [FLAC]
albumB [MP3]
albumB [FLAC]

MinimServer always merges multidisc albums across folders unless there is a match filter preventing this. This assumes that the different discs have the same title and the same AlbumArtist or Artist tagging. The audio format isn't considered when doing this merging.

If the MP3 and FLAC discs for albumB match these merging rules, I'd expect the first display to be:

albumB

and the second display to be:

albumB [MP3, FLAC]

If the MP3 and FLAC discs for albumB don't match these merging rules, I'd expect the first display to be:

albumB
albumB

and the second display to be:

albumB [MP3]
albumB [FLAC]

What tags are the MP3 and FLAC discs for albumB using for Album, Artist and AlbumArtist?


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - winxi - 14-04-2013 16:58

(14-04-2013 16:10)simoncn Wrote:  MinimServer always merges multidisc albums across folders unless there is a match filter preventing this. This assumes that the different discs have the same title and the same AlbumArtist or Artist tagging. The audio format isn't considered when doing this merging.

If the MP3 and FLAC discs for albumB match these merging rules, I'd expect the first display to be:

albumB

and the second display to be:

albumB [MP3, FLAC]

If the MP3 and FLAC discs for albumB don't match these merging rules, I'd expect the first display to be:

albumB
albumB

and the second display to be:

albumB [MP3]
albumB [FLAC]

What tags are the MP3 and FLAC discs for albumB using for Album, Artist and AlbumArtist?

Thanks for the explanation and sorry for the false alarm. I've to describe the cirumstances a bit more in detail. I've ripped my CD collection to FLAC under the toplevel directory /music/FLAC. I've also transcoded these albums to MP3, these are stored under the toplevel directory /music/FLAC2MP3. The FLAC albums are tagged exactly the same way as the corresponding MP3 albums, except that for the FLAC albums I've added ' (FLAC)' to the album tag. This seems to be the reason that until now the multidisc match filter prevented merging. A concrete example for an album in my library would be 'Siamese Dream' from 'The Smashing Pumpkins' (this is the 2012 deluxe edition with a bonus CD, so it is a multi-disc album). Until now, the control point showed in the album list:
Siamese Dream
Siamese Dream (FLAC)

Having the great tagFormat property in MinimServer, I've happily removed ' (FLAC)' from the FLAC album titles and applied
Album.displayFormat={$album^$#AudioFormat^ [^]}
I mistakenly expected the album list to be
Siamese Dream [MP3]
Siamese Dream [FLAC]

but it was
Siamese Dream [MP3, FLAC]

This of course only for the multi-disc albums. So according to your description, this is the right behaviour of MinimServer. Sorry for the confusion.

As a suggestion, it may be better to consider also the format when merging (maybe as an option). Or you could merge only these albums which have the same parent directory (e.g. /artist/album/disc1 and /artist/album/disc2). What do you think?


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - simoncn - 14-04-2013 17:23

(14-04-2013 16:58)winxi Wrote:  Thanks for the explanation and sorry for the false alarm. I've to describe the cirumstances a bit more in detail. I've ripped my CD collection to FLAC under the toplevel directory /music/FLAC. I've also transcoded these albums to MP3, these are stored under the toplevel directory /music/FLAC2MP3. The FLAC albums are tagged exactly the same way as the corresponding MP3 albums, except that for the FLAC albums I've added ' (FLAC)' to the album tag. This seems to be the reason that until now the multidisc match filter prevented merging.

These files weren't being merged because the album title was different. The match filter only comes into play if the album titles are the same.

Quote: A concrete example for an album in my library would be 'Siamese Dream' from 'The Smashing Pumpkins' (this is the 2012 deluxe edition with a bonus CD, so it is a multi-disc album). Until now, the control point showed in the album list:
Siamese Dream
Siamese Dream (FLAC)

Having the great tagFormat property in MinimServer, I've happily removed ' (FLAC)' from the FLAC album titles and applied
Album.displayFormat={$album^$#AudioFormat^ [^]}
I mistakenly expected the album list to be
Siamese Dream [MP3]
Siamese Dream [FLAC]

but it was
Siamese Dream [MP3, FLAC]

This of course only for the multi-disc albums. So according to your description, this is the right behaviour of MinimServer. Sorry for the confusion.

As a suggestion, it may be better to consider also the format when merging (maybe as an option). Or you could merge only these albums which have the same parent directory (e.g. /artist/album/disc1 and /artist/album/disc2). What do you think?

I think you should use the match filter, because it's provided for exactly this purpose. Smile

If you tag the MP3 album files with a match filter of ['MP3'] and the FLAC album files with a match filter of ['FLAC'], you should get two multidisc albums with the same title and correct merging behaviour.


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - winxi - 14-04-2013 19:47

(14-04-2013 17:23)simoncn Wrote:  I think you should use the match filter, because it's provided for exactly this purpose. Smile

If you tag the MP3 album files with a match filter of ['MP3'] and the FLAC album files with a match filter of ['FLAC'], you should get two multidisc albums with the same title and correct merging behaviour.

Many thanks for your patience to sort this out with me! I've focused too much onto the new features that I forgot about all the "old" goodies Smile.


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - bbrip - 15-04-2013 20:29

Sorry to be off-topic (maybe), but is it really a good idea to mingle the same album lossless and lossy in the same library??

All my lossy albums used for car, iphone etc are well separated from my main listening library.

bbrip


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - simoncn - 15-04-2013 20:36

(15-04-2013 20:29)bbrip Wrote:  Sorry to be off-topic (maybe), but is it really a good idea to mingle the same album lossless and lossy in the same library??

All my lossy albums used for car, iphone etc are well separated from my main listening library.

bbrip

MinimServer gives you the choice of doing it either way. Smile


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - winxi - 15-04-2013 21:10

(15-04-2013 20:29)bbrip Wrote:  Sorry to be off-topic (maybe), but is it really a good idea to mingle the same album lossless and lossy in the same library??

All my lossy albums used for car, iphone etc are well separated from my main listening library.

bbrip

The main reasons for having my FLAC tracks doubled are
1) I have renderers that do not support FLAC/WAV playback but do support MP3 (e.g. a Sony TV)
2) I use BubbleUPnP Server to stream over a mobile connection to my phone. For this I use MP3 to save bandwidth.

BubbleUPnP Server would be able to do realtime FLAC->MP3 transcoding even on my weak ARM NAS with a special version of ffmpeg featuring libshine. But as long as I have enough free storage available, I prefer it this way. Until now, I had no problem switching between FLAC and MP3 using folder view and subsequently tag view again. The new special index tag #AudioFormat provides an even better way to do this.


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - Oliviander - 16-04-2013 08:30

(14-04-2013 17:23)simoncn Wrote:  I think you should use the match filter, because it's provided for exactly this purpose. Smile

If you tag the MP3 album files with a match filter of ['MP3'] and the FLAC album files with a match filter of ['FLAC'], you should get two multidisc albums with the same title and correct merging behaviour.

Hi Simon,
I just read this thread. Until now I had no problems regarding
this topic, but as I am now into ripping my SACDs
I soon may run into this same problem.

I understand what you have described in the thread and in the users manual. But I am not very happy with it.
I am already enough concerned tagging my files in a correct way,
I really don't want to have to think about Folder names with "Matchfilters".
Therefore I really would prefer if you had a property
that would do what the existing property
MergeFolderAlbums=false actually indicates:
!! Preventing Folder Merging in any case!!
I think many (if not most) people have their collections
organized in that way Put everything in one folder
what you what to display as an album.
(and of course have the same album tag)
Plain and simple not concerning about multiple albums
and folder naming.


RE: Album.displayFormat merges multi-disc albums - simoncn - 16-04-2013 08:38

(16-04-2013 08:30)Oliviander Wrote:  
(14-04-2013 17:23)simoncn Wrote:  I think you should use the match filter, because it's provided for exactly this purpose. Smile

If you tag the MP3 album files with a match filter of ['MP3'] and the FLAC album files with a match filter of ['FLAC'], you should get two multidisc albums with the same title and correct merging behaviour.

Hi Simon,
I just read this thread. Until now I had no problems regarding
this topic, but as I am now into ripping my SACDs
I soon may run into this same problem.

I understand what you have described in the thread and in the users manual. But I am not very happy with it.
I am already enough concerned tagging my files in a correct way,
I really don't want to have to think about Folder names with "Matchfilters".
Therefore I really would prefer if you had a property
that would do what the existing property
MergeFolderAlbums=false actually indicates:
!! Preventing Folder Merging in any case!!
I think many (if not most) people have their collections
organized in that way Put everything in one folder
what you what to display as an album.
(and of course have the same album tag)
Plain and simple not concerning about multiple albums
and folder naming.

I think it is very common for a multi-disc album to be ripped with each disc in a different folder. The current approach allows for this.