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+--- Thread: Sorting in folders (/showthread.php?tid=1476)
RE: Sorting in folders - jes - 13-05-2014 00:44
Not sure what the difference is between Artist and All Artist. Why would an artist show in one but not the other? Anyway, I've added the All Artist tag, and the second artist does not show either. I do a rescan every time I make a tag change so that all info is the most current.
RE: Sorting in folders - simoncn - 13-05-2014 06:27
(13-05-2014 00:44)jes Wrote: Not sure what the difference is between Artist and All Artist. Why would an artist show in one but not the other? Anyway, I've added the All Artist tag, and the second artist does not show either. I do a rescan every time I make a tag change so that all info is the most current.
There are two differences between the Artist index and the All Artists index:
1) If there is an AlbumArtist tag for the album, the Artist index entry for the album will be the AlbumArtist value instead of the Artist value(s). The All Artists index will have a separate entry for each Artist value.
2) If there are multiple Artist tags for the album and no AlbumArtist tag, the Artist index entry for the album will be a combination of all these artists (e.g., 'John Smith, Mel Jones'). The All Artists index will have separate entries for each artist (e.g., 'John Smith' and 'Mel Jones').
If there is no AlbumArtist tag and a single Artist tag, or if there is a single Artist tag with the same value as the AlbumArtist tag, the Artist and All Artists entries for the album will be the same.
Have you checked the MinimServer log to see if there are any warnings about incorrect tagging for this album?
If there aren't any warnings, please upload one track from this album to my FTP server and I will look at the tagging. I'll PM you the server details now.
RE: Sorting in folders - simoncn - 13-05-2014 08:32
(13-05-2014 06:27)simoncn Wrote: If there aren't any warnings, please upload one track from this album to my FTP server and I will look at the tagging. I'll PM you the server details now.
Thanks for uploading this file. I've looked at the tagging and it isn't in the correct format. The ID3v2.3 TPE1 frame (Artist) has the artists separated by a NUL (0x0000) character. According to the ID3v2.3 specification, mutiple values in the TPE1 frame should be separated by a slash '/' character and anything after a NUL character should be ignored. Here are the relevant sections from the ID3v2.3 specification:
Code:
TPE1
The 'Lead artist(s)/Lead performer(s)/Soloist(s)/Performing group' is
used for the main artist(s). They are seperated with the "/"
character.Code:
4.2. Text information frames
The text information frames are the most important frames, containing
information like artist, album and more. There may only be one text
information frame of its kind in an tag. If the textstring is
followed by a termination ($00 (00)) all the following information
should be ignored and not be displayed. All text frame identifiers
begin with "T". Only text frame identifiers begin with "T", with the
exception of the "TXXX" frame. All the text information frames have
the following format:
<Header for 'Text information frame', ID: "T000" - "TZZZ",
excluding "TXXX" described in 4.2.2.>
Text encoding $xx
Information <text string according to encoding>To work around this MP3tag bug, you can set the Mp3tag options to save the file as ID3v2.4 instead of ID3v2.3. Mp3tag seems to handle ID3v2.4 tags correctly according to the specification.
I will report this bug to the author of Mp3tag.
RE: Sorting in folders - jes - 13-05-2014 14:25
I saved "Smith, John/Jones, Mel" as ID3v2.4, but the result is the same. Only one entry (Smith, John/Jones, Mel), both in Artist and All Artist. No separation. Even if it worked, I don't want to change to whole library to 2.4 from 2.3. I give up. Thanks so much for your help.
BTW: You mentioned earlier that MinimServer does not support ID3v1 tags. Would you generally recommend to remove all v1 tags from the files and only have v2 tags, or is there a benefit from keeping v1 tags?
RE: Sorting in folders - simoncn - 13-05-2014 15:58
(13-05-2014 14:25)jes Wrote: I saved "Smith, John/Jones, Mel" as ID3v2.4, but the result is the same. Only one entry (Smith, John/Jones, Mel), both in Artist and All Artist. No separation. Even if it worked, I don't want to change to whole library to 2.4 from 2.3. I give up. Thanks so much for your help.
In ID3v2.4, the correct delimiter between artist values is NUL, not '/'. If you set the Artist value to 'Smith, John\\Jones, Mel' and save this as ID3v2.4, you should see both artists.
Quote:BTW: You mentioned earlier that MinimServer does not support ID3v1 tags. Would you generally recommend to remove all v1 tags from the files and only have v2 tags, or is there a benefit from keeping v1 tags?
In my experience, files with an ID3v1 tag in them generally seem to have an ID3v2 tag as well. MinimServer reads the ID3v2 tag and ignores the ID3v1 tag, so there is no harm in having both tags present. The only reason to keep the ID3v1 tag would be if you are using the file with a server or player that can only read ID3v1 tags.
RE: Sorting in folders - jes - 14-05-2014 02:16
I tried 'Smith, John\\Jones, Mel' as 2.4. For Artist, I get one artist entry 'Smith, John, Jones, Mel'. For All Artist, I get 2 artists, i.e. 'Smith, John' and 'Jones, Mel'. Is that how it should be? I don't like the one artist tag entry.
RE: Sorting in folders - simoncn - 14-05-2014 08:57
(14-05-2014 02:16)jes Wrote: I tried 'Smith, John\\Jones, Mel' as 2.4. For Artist, I get one artist entry 'Smith, John, Jones, Mel'. For All Artist, I get 2 artists, i.e. 'Smith, John' and 'Jones, Mel'. Is that how it should be? I don't like the one artist tag entry.
Yes, that is how it should be. You can customize these values in various ways:
1) You can reverse the names for index and display purposes by using the tagOptions setting
Artist.reverseName.index.display
This will display the combined Artist entry as
John Smith, Mel Jones
and it will still be sorted under 'S' for Smith
2) You can change the separator between the artist names by using a tagFormat setting. for example, to display the artists as
Smith, John & Jones, Mel
you can use the tagformat setting
Artist.indexFormat={$artist^^^ & }
3) If you don't like having a combined Artist tag entry for both artists, you can replace the Artist index by the All Artists index by removing Artist from indexTags and including the setting 'All Artists:Artist' in indexTags. For example, your indexTags setting could be:
All Artists:Artist, Date, Genre
RE: Sorting in folders - jes - 14-05-2014 09:37
I am learning a lot about tagging, that's great. Many thanks. What's left now is to find a tagging program that is ID3v2.3 standard-compliant to avoid going to 2.4. Obviously, it is not Mp3tag. I don't think ID3-TagIt is, and TagScanner appears not to be either. Do you have a recommendation for a tag program?
RE: Sorting in folders - simoncn - 14-05-2014 09:49
(14-05-2014 09:37)jes Wrote: I am learning a lot about tagging, that's great. Many thanks. What's left now is to find a tagging program that is ID3v2.3 standard-compliant to avoid going to 2.4. Obviously, it is not Mp3tag. I don't think ID3-TagIt is, and TagScanner appears not to be either. Do you have a recommendation for a tag program?
I have reported the ID3v2.3 problem to the author of Mp3tag. I'll let you know when I get a response.
What is your concern about moving to ID3v2.4? It has some worthwhile improvements over ID3v2.3 and seems to be widely supported by other software.
RE: Sorting in folders - jes - 14-05-2014 10:15
I think I read previously that 2.3 is the most-widely accepted standard, with 2.4 not universally implemented, so I thought that sticking with 2.3 is the safest option. It looks that Mp3tag has 2.3 as its write default. I have not researched the 2.3/2.4 issue in great detail, but I am open to any suggestions.