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Full Version: Alpha Group for Albums sorted by Artist?
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I currently have my albums sorted by Artist using the tag option Album.sortTags={Artist, Album}. This mean all my albums are listed in artist order which is my preference. However I have many albums and would like to put the albums in an alpha group for easier access.

When I do this, the albums are split by album title (so all albums beginning with A for example), but what I would like is for them to be split by artist (i.e. all albums by artists beginning with A). Is this possible please?

Many thanks.
(05-01-2016 09:25)timster Wrote: [ -> ]I currently have my albums sorted by Artist using the tag option Album.sortTags={Artist, Album}. This mean all my albums are listed in artist order which is my preference. However I have many albums and would like to put the albums in an alpha group for easier access.

When I do this, the albums are split by album title (so all albums beginning with A for example), but what I would like is for them to be split by artist (i.e. all albums by artists beginning with A). Is this possible please?

Many thanks.

Thanks for this suggestion. I think it would make sense to use the first tag in sortTags to do alpha-grouping (for all lists that support sortTags). I will investigate this and post back here.

Does anyone have any concerns about making this change to how alpha-grouping works?
(05-01-2016 22:11)simoncn Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-01-2016 09:25)timster Wrote: [ -> ]I currently have my albums sorted by Artist using the tag option Album.sortTags={Artist, Album}. This mean all my albums are listed in artist order which is my preference. However I have many albums and would like to put the albums in an alpha group for easier access.

When I do this, the albums are split by album title (so all albums beginning with A for example), but what I would like is for them to be split by artist (i.e. all albums by artists beginning with A). Is this possible please?

Many thanks.

Thanks for this suggestion. I think it would make sense to use the first tag in sortTags to do alpha-grouping (for all lists that support sortTags). I will investigate this and post back here.

Does anyone have any concerns about making this change to how alpha-grouping works?

Thanks for looking into it Simon - I would hope there won't be any concerns, like you say it makes sense that if one wants to sort items on a particular tag that the same sort would want to be applied when grouping them.
(06-01-2016 09:24)timster Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks for looking into it Simon - I would hope there won't be any concerns, like you say it makes sense that if one wants to sort items on a particular tag that the same sort would want to be applied when grouping them.

Unfortunately, there are some problems with this. For example, many people sort albums by Date but using the date for alpha-grouping wouldn't be useful. (Grouping by years or decades would be more appropriate.) Also, if the tag used for sorting doesn't physically appear on screen in the album list, alpha-grouping by something invisible could be very confusing.

An alternative approach for viewing an album list grouped by artist name is to use the Artist index. This displays a list of alpha-grouped artists and you can select any artist name to view the albums for that artist. This approach also solves the "date" and "invisible tag" issues.
(06-01-2016 10:56)simoncn Wrote: [ -> ]
(06-01-2016 09:24)timster Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks for looking into it Simon - I would hope there won't be any concerns, like you say it makes sense that if one wants to sort items on a particular tag that the same sort would want to be applied when grouping them.

Unfortunately, there are some problems with this. For example, many people sort albums by Date but using the date for alpha-grouping wouldn't be useful. (Grouping by years or decades would be more appropriate.) Also, if the tag used for sorting doesn't physically appear on screen in the album list, alpha-grouping by something invisible could be very confusing.

An alternative approach for viewing an album list grouped by artist name is to use the Artist index. This displays a list of alpha-grouped artists and you can select any artist name to view the albums for that artist. This approach also solves the "date" and "invisible tag" issues.

Yes I see the issues there. The other approach you mention isn't really what I was looking for. Shame.

But.. but seeing as Minim is so powerful, I wonder if it could be an option rather than a feature (if you see what I mean) in a future major release? A new alphaGroupSortOptions field in Server Properties could be an option list, so in my case putting "album" in the list would make it sort by the first field in album.sorttags (as initially thought). If its not in the list then it'll sort by the default tag. Or even an option flag in the SortTags field - if true, group will be sorted by the tag too.

Possible?
(06-01-2016 12:14)timster Wrote: [ -> ]Yes I see the issues there. The other approach you mention isn't really what I was looking for. Shame.

But.. but seeing as Minim is so powerful, I wonder if it could be an option rather than a feature (if you see what I mean) in a future major release? A new alphaGroupSortOptions field in Server Properties could be an option list, so in my case putting "album" in the list would make it sort by the first field in album.sorttags (as initially thought). If its not in the list then it'll sort by the default tag. Or even an option flag in the SortTags field - if true, group will be sorted by the tag too.

Possible?

I would like to get the views of other users on this. In particular, if people want to be able to do this, is it only for alpha-grouping by artist name in the '# albums' list or is there a requirement for other kinds of customized alpha-grouping as well?
(06-01-2016 13:49)simoncn Wrote: [ -> ]
(06-01-2016 12:14)timster Wrote: [ -> ]Yes I see the issues there. The other approach you mention isn't really what I was looking for. Shame.

But.. but seeing as Minim is so powerful, I wonder if it could be an option rather than a feature (if you see what I mean) in a future major release? A new alphaGroupSortOptions field in Server Properties could be an option list, so in my case putting "album" in the list would make it sort by the first field in album.sorttags (as initially thought). If its not in the list then it'll sort by the default tag. Or even an option flag in the SortTags field - if true, group will be sorted by the tag too.

Possible?

I would like to get the views of other users on this. In particular, if people want to be able to do this, is it only for alpha-grouping by artist name in the '# albums' list or is there a requirement for other kinds of customized alpha-grouping as well?

OK, I'll point some people I know to here to see what they think too.
(05-01-2016 22:11)simoncn Wrote: [ -> ]
(05-01-2016 09:25)timster Wrote: [ -> ]I currently have my albums sorted by Artist using the tag option Album.sortTags={Artist, Album}. This mean all my albums are listed in artist order which is my preference. However I have many albums and would like to put the albums in an alpha group for easier access.

When I do this, the albums are split by album title (so all albums beginning with A for example), but what I would like is for them to be split by artist (i.e. all albums by artists beginning with A). Is this possible please?

Many thanks.

Thanks for this suggestion. I think it would make sense to use the first tag in sortTags to do alpha-grouping (for all lists that support sortTags). I will investigate this and post back here.

Does anyone have any concerns about making this change to how alpha-grouping works?

Hi

I've about 4000 albums and have set alpha-grouping to kick in anywhere where a container exceeds 200 items. Mostly, I use albumArtist -> album to find stuff and the current system seems to be ideal, so I can't quite get my head around what's being proposed. In fact, I actually use something more complex than that as I actually use the Ensemble value (with it set to display as 'Album Artists' on the CP menu, so perhaps any change would not even be noticed by me? I do occasionally use artist, but only when trying to find a 'one hit wonder', for example, from my compilations.

Are you thinking that navigating into the albums container, then after opening the 'Z' sub-container you would find the album 'Afterburner' (by ZZ Top), for example, or am I totally misunderstanding the request (I'm assuming you aren't suggesting that, but I'm just using that to highlight my confusion over what is being proposed)? Smile

Could you perhaps give an example of the navigation route being proposed (perhaps using the above and other examples) such that I can get my head round what's being proposed?

Whatever is being proposed, I love the system that I am currently using (so Afterburner is in the Albums -> A container, which is where it should be located), so as long as any changes are optional, I can see no harm in it (though it's not something I'd like to use).

All the best
Bri

PS Apologies if I'm being thick; I suspect that I am just not understanding what's being suggested (thus the request for an example).
I'm happy with the current system, but I only have about 1500 albums and only use alpha grouping for the items list and the artists list. I'm quite content using Simon's system: I use album artist to see albums grouped by artist, and the album list to see them sorted by album title. Alpha grouping albums and having them sort by artist wouldn't do anything for me, but I guess it wouldn't impact me either.
(06-01-2016 14:34)Briain Wrote: [ -> ]Are you thinking that navigating into the albums container, then after opening the 'Z' sub-container you would find the album 'Afterburner' (by ZZ Top), for example, or am I totally misunderstanding the request (I'm assuming you aren't suggesting that, but I'm just using that to highlight my confusion over what is being proposed)? Smile

Yes, this is what is being proposed if you have set Album.sortTags={Artist, Album}.

I suspect you are not the only person who would find this surprising.
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