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Hi Simon

I tried MinimServer/Kazoo with JPLAY6 Beta2. It sounded good but I had a few issues that I could solve. I posted these on the JPLAY Forum and Josef suggested I post them here for your attention. I would be grateful for any advice that you can offer. My post on the JPLAY Forum was as follows:

"Having tried to get MinimServer/Kazoo working, I reverted to foobar2000/MonkeyMote. I could not fix the following issues:

1. I have three external USB drives. Each drive has three directories, namely 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD. While I could import from one external drive, I could not import from the other two. I got a message in red (I can't recall the exact wording) asking me to correct the problem. The software obviously couldn't import from the other drives. Perhaps it couldn't see the other drives? Perhaps there is a limit to how many sources can be imported when using MinimServer. Reverting to foobar2000/MonkeyMote fixed the problem immediately and my entire collection of digital music was available.

2. Although I added the necessary line, I could not get MinimServer to add files from DSD directories. They were not imported. The files are DSF, created from SACD iso files using Sonore iso2dsd. These files play without any problems in foobar2000 with appropriate plugin.

3. When albums were imported, there were corruptions in the tag data, resulting in small squares being placed next to the Artist or Album Title. The track order was incorrectly imported with many albums. While all tracks played, they were played in the wrong order!

My inability to solve these issues is disappointing although I accept that JPLAY6 is a beta. I have no doubt that a definitive setup will be achieved in time. I hope this will be the case as the sound with MinimServer/Kazoo was very good and probably better than foobar2000/MonkeyMote. My system still sounds very good and while I would have liked to retain MinimServer/Kazoo, the challenges that it posed were not within my capability to solve. Either way, JPLAY6 is, to my ears, a significant improvement over JPLAY 5.2.1.

herman17

Thank you for your response regarding the small squares appearing in the tag data, perhaps caused by null characters. It may well be due to a bug in JRiver Media Center as I used this software until JRiver prevented its use in conjunction with JPLAY. When I reverted to fobar2000 from MinimServer, there were no apparent issues with the tags or playing order.

Josef

Thanks for your response. Is there any advantage in running foobar2000 with foobar with the UPnP plugin and Kazoo? Will this work? At present I am using MonkeyMote and would not change unless it was likely to bring about an improvement in sound quality."


Thanks for any replies
(25-02-2015 00:30)JazzDoc Wrote: [ -> ]Hi Simon

I tried MinimServer/Kazoo with JPLAY6 Beta2. It sounded good but I had a few issues that I could solve. I posted these on the JPLAY Forum and Josef suggested I post them here for your attention. I would be grateful for any advice that you can offer. My post on the JPLAY Forum was as follows:

Welcome to the MinimServer forum!

Quote:1. I have three external USB drives. Each drive has three directories, namely 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD. While I could import from one external drive, I could not import from the other two. I got a message in red (I can't recall the exact wording) asking me to correct the problem. The software obviously couldn't import from the other drives. Perhaps it couldn't see the other drives? Perhaps there is a limit to how many sources can be imported when using MinimServer. Reverting to foobar2000/MonkeyMote fixed the problem immediately and my entire collection of digital music was available.

MinimServer can import from multiple content directories on multiple drives. There is a limit of 8 content directories in total and it sounds like you would like to use 9 directories. To solve this, you can create a parent directory on each drive for the 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD directories and this would mean you need to import these 3 parent directories only.

MinimServer doesn't allow duplicate last names for your top-level content directories (such as the 'bar' in foo/bar and xyz/bar). This might have been the error message that you saw. To solve this, you need to make sure the last name in the path of each content directory is different. There is no problem with having duplicate names for the lower-level directories that contain your files.

Quote:2. Although I added the necessary line, I could not get MinimServer to add files from DSD directories. They were not imported. The files are DSF, created from SACD iso files using Sonore iso2dsd. These files play without any problems in foobar2000 with appropriate plugin.

I think the line you added was for transcoding .dsf files. This doesn't affect whether or not the .dsf files are imported and show up when you browse your library. Do the .dsf files contain tags? If not, they won't show up under Artist or albums but you can find them under [folder view] or [untagged]. If they aren't shown in either of these places, please check the MinimServer log for error messages.

Quote:3. When albums were imported, there were corruptions in the tag data, resulting in small squares being placed next to the Artist or Album Title. The track order was incorrectly imported with many albums. While all tracks played, they were played in the wrong order!

As herman17 has said, this is probably caused by a bug in older versions of JRiver that caused NUL (0x00) characters to be written at the end of tag values in FLAC files. You can solve this by converting the files with a newer version of JRiver or another converter such as dBpoweramp. You don't see this problem with foobar2000 because it is written in C or C++ and these languages automatically terminate a string at the first NUL character.

Quote:My inability to solve these issues is disappointing although I accept that JPLAY6 is a beta. I have no doubt that a definitive setup will be achieved in time. I hope this will be the case as the sound with MinimServer/Kazoo was very good and probably better than foobar2000/MonkeyMote. My system still sounds very good and while I would have liked to retain MinimServer/Kazoo, the challenges that it posed were not within my capability to solve. Either way, JPLAY6 is, to my ears, a significant improvement over JPLAY 5.2.1.

I hope you will decide to make another attempt with MinimServer. All these problems should be soluble. If you have any more questions or need further advice on how to solve these problems, please post back here.
Thanks for the reply Simon. I will try to get the issues sorted when I have time.

With regard to importing directories from hard drives, I managed to import the 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD directories from one of my drives. These three directories were in a higher level directory that I called Digital Audio. In my other drives i have the 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD directories in the root drive. They are not combined in a single directory. On these other two drives, any attempt to import is met with an immediate error message.

Perhaps I need to have just one directory on each drive?
(25-02-2015 12:31)JazzDoc Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks for the reply Simon. I will try to get the issues sorted when I have time.

With regard to importing directories from hard drives, I managed to import the 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD directories from one of my drives. These three directories were in a higher level directory that I called Digital Audio. In my other drives i have the 16-Bit, HiRes and DSD directories in the root drive. They are not combined in a single directory. On these other two drives, any attempt to import is met with an immediate error message.

Perhaps I need to have just one directory on each drive?

To enter the root directory for a mapped Windows drive letter, you should enter something like H:\. If the drive is accessed via a UNC path to a network share, you should enter \\hostname\sharename. What was the exact path that you entered for the root directory? What was the exact error message?
"To enter the root directory for a mapped Windows drive letter, you should enter something like H:\. If the drive is accessed via a UNC path to a network share, you should enter \\hostname\sharename. What was the exact path that you entered for the root directory? What was the exact error message? "

I would have entered P:/16-Bit or P:/Hires as an example. I can't recall the exact wording. I will reinstall MinimServer when I have time and will check. This will take a little time as I will need to uninstall Audiophile Optimizer 1.30 and Fidelizer Pro 6.5. While this may not be necessary, it's probably safer.


"3. When albums were imported, there were corruptions in the tag data, resulting in small squares being placed next to the Artist or Album Title. The track order was incorrectly imported with many albums. While all tracks played, they were played in the wrong order!


As herman17 has said, this is probably caused by a bug in older versions of JRiver that caused NUL (0x00) characters to be written at the end of tag values in FLAC files. You can solve this by converting the files with a newer version of JRiver or another converter such as dBpoweramp. You don't see this problem with foobar2000 because it is written in C or C++ and these languages automatically terminate a string at the first NUL character."

I have dBpoweramp and a licence for JRiver Media Center 20. Could you please detail how I would undertake the conversion? I trust that converting would not do any damage to the tags should the need arise to revert to foobar2000.


Sorry to ask these questions. My technical knowledge is limited!

Thanks again for your reply Simon
(25-02-2015 20:02)JazzDoc Wrote: [ -> ]I have dBpoweramp and a licence for JRiver Media Center 20. Could you please detail how I would undertake the conversion? I trust that converting would not do any damage to the tags should the need arise to revert to foobar2000.

I haven't used JRiver to do this but I have used dBpoweramp Music Converter. Select a FLAC file (or group of files), specify FLAC in the 'Converting to' field, then click the Convert button. You should probably specify a different output folder so that your original FLAC files don't get overwritten. Your tags will be preserved (without the troublesome NUL characters). It's a good idea to try this on one album before you convert your whole library.
The problem with file import may have been solved. I have managed to import contents of two of my four external USB drives. When I put everything into a single directory and then import only the drive letter, e.g. V:\ then it seems to work fine.

I am still having problems playing back the DSD files that I have extracted from SACD iso files using Sonore iso2dsd. The file extension on these files is dsf so I figure it should work. When I play a dsf file, the HiRes light illuminates on my Naim DAC but I just get hiss coming out of the speaker. On some tracks the music can be faintly heard. I have tried playing back these files in foobar2000 and everything is OK. A post on JPLAY Forum indicated that there might be a problem with dsf files and JPLAY6 Beta 3. This does not appear to be the case as foobar2000 will play them. I obviously need to crack this problem if I am to continue to try out MinimServer but today's results are more encouraging.

Can you offer any suggestions please Simon. I have followed instructions from JPLAY Forum (First thread of http://jplay.eu/forum/jplay/jplay-6-beta-program/) to install so I am scratching my head!

As always ... Thanks
(26-02-2015 04:00)JazzDoc Wrote: [ -> ]The problem with file import may have been solved. I have managed to import contents of two of my four external USB drives. When I put everything into a single directory and then import only the drive letter, e.g. V:\ then it seems to work fine.

I am still having problems playing back the DSD files that I have extracted from SACD iso files using Sonore iso2dsd. The file extension on these files is dsf so I figure it should work. When I play a dsf file, the HiRes light illuminates on my Naim DAC but I just get hiss coming out of the speaker. On some tracks the music can be faintly heard. I have tried playing back these files in foobar2000 and everything is OK. A post on JPLAY Forum indicated that there might be a problem with dsf files and JPLAY6 Beta 3. This does not appear to be the case as foobar2000 will play them. I obviously need to crack this problem if I am to continue to try out MinimServer but today's results are more encouraging.

Can you offer any suggestions please Simon. I have followed instructions from JPLAY Forum (First thread of http://jplay.eu/forum/jplay/jplay-6-beta-program/) to install so I am scratching my head!

As always ... Thanks

If you have dsf:dopwav enabled, MinimServer is sending these files in DoP/WAV format. This format is a PCM wrapper for DSD data. The Naim DAC doesn't understand DoP/WAV, so it plays the stream as if it were a normal PCM stream, which doesn't work. foobar2000 is converting the DSF file to a normal PCM stream and the Naim DAC is playing this PCM stream.

There are many DSD-capable DACs that understand the DoP/WAV format and can play the wrapped DSD data. Unfortunately, the Naim DAC isn't one of them.
Thanks again for your reply Simon. That explains things. I first used DSD to PCM conversion when I used JRiver Media Center and also install the appropriate component to achieve this conversion in foobar2000. To my ears, DSD files converted on the fly sounded better than PCM files extracted directly from the iso. I really need DSD functionality in my system as I have a lot of DSD albums. I wouldn't want to replace the Naim DAC. For starters, I couldn't afford it!

I guess that means that my experience with MinimServer has to end and I need to revert to foobar2000. If you can suggest any alternatives then I would be interested as I really liked the sound of MinimServer/Kazoo and would probably have stayed with the combination were it not for inability to play DSD files through my Naim DAC.
(26-02-2015 10:44)JazzDoc Wrote: [ -> ]Thanks again for your reply Simon. That explains things. I first used DSD to PCM conversion when I used JRiver Media Center and also install the appropriate component to achieve this conversion in foobar2000. To my ears, DSD files converted on the fly sounded better than PCM files extracted directly from the iso. I really need DSD functionality in my system as I have a lot of DSD albums. I wouldn't want to replace the Naim DAC. For starters, I couldn't afford it!

I guess that means that my experience with MinimServer has to end and I need to revert to foobar2000. If you can suggest any alternatives then I would be interested as I really liked the sound of MinimServer/Kazoo and would probably have stayed with the combination were it not for inability to play DSD files through my Naim DAC.

The good news is that ffmpeg has recently added support for converting DSF files to PCM. I should be able to provide support for this in MinimStreamer as an additional transcoding option in the fairly near future. I'll post back here when this support is available.
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