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DSD files and the Oppo
25-04-2013, 00:06 (This post was last modified: 25-04-2013 00:09 by wappinghigh.)
Post: #1
DSD files and the Oppo
I don't have an Oppo yet. But gee am I now tempted with the release of the new beta that apparently allows DSD streaming (both stereo and multichannel) via DLNA..

Can you see where I am coming from here? If we could tag PCM vs DSD files and Stereo vs multichannel then use MinimServer via the Oppo:....BINGO! All file formats and stereo vs multichannel covered on the one player.... off a NAS!!!

However some Oppo owners (and Minimserver fans) over on computeraudiophile and a couple of other sites have found MinimServer can't stream DSD files properly. Can someone clarify why that is? And could this be rectified in a MS firmware upgrade? Cheers.
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25-04-2013, 18:53
Post: #2
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(25-04-2013 00:06)wappinghigh Wrote:  I don't have an Oppo yet. But gee am I now tempted with the release of the new beta that apparently allows DSD streaming (both stereo and multichannel) via DLNA..

Can you see where I am coming from here? If we could tag PCM vs DSD files and Stereo vs multichannel then use MinimServer via the Oppo:....BINGO! All file formats and stereo vs multichannel covered on the one player.... off a NAS!!!

However some Oppo owners (and Minimserver fans) over on computeraudiophile and a couple of other sites have found MinimServer can't stream DSD files properly. Can someone clarify why that is? And could this be rectified in a MS firmware upgrade? Cheers.

This might be caused by the MIME type that MinimServer is sending. However, I've tried streaming DFF files using foobar2000 as a UPnP server, and it sends the same MIME type as MinimServer (application/octet-stream). There might be some other difference between how foobar and MinimServer stream these files, and I'm looking into this.

Do the posts on Computer Audiophile and other sites say that the Oppo 103/105 can stream DFF or DSF files from any other UPnP servers (such as foobar or JRiver)? If so, it should be possible for MinimServer to send the same information as these other servers. Everything I've seen so far says only that this streaming works from a local file or an SMB share, wihch isn't the same as streaming from a UPnP server.
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26-04-2013, 00:25
Post: #3
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(25-04-2013 18:53)simoncn Wrote:  This might be caused by the MIME type that MinimServer is sending. However, I've tried streaming DFF files using foobar2000 as a UPnP server, and it sends the same MIME type as MinimServer (application/octet-stream). There might be some other difference between how foobar and MinimServer stream these files, and I'm looking into this.

I've tracked down this other difference, and I'll add a fix to the next release of MinimServer. It will improve the ability of foobar to play DSD and DSF files served by MinimServer, but I don't expect it will help with playing these files on the OPPO.

Quote:Do the posts on Computer Audiophile and other sites say that the Oppo 103/105 can stream DFF or DSF files from any other UPnP servers (such as foobar or JRiver)? If so, it should be possible for MinimServer to send the same information as these other servers. Everything I've seen so far says only that this streaming works from a local file or an SMB share, wihch isn't the same as streaming from a UPnP server.

I've done some testing to find out what other media servers use for MIME types. JRiver streams DSF and DFF files with a blank Content-Type header, which is illegal according to the HTTP specification. foobar2000 and MinimServer send a Content-Type of application/octet-stream for both DSF and DFF. The OPPO supposedly requires audio/x-dsf for DSF and ??? for DFF. It's not clear where audio/x-dsf comes from, as the only other reference I can find to this is for some other format that has nothing to do with DSD audio.

If this sounds like a complete mess, that's because it is a complete mess. Whatever happened to interoperable standards?
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26-04-2013, 07:30
Post: #4
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(25-04-2013 18:53)simoncn Wrote:  Do the posts on Computer Audiophile and other sites say that the Oppo 103/105 can stream DFF or DSF files from any other UPnP servers (such as foobar or JRiver)?

Hello Simon, I am the guy that has posted on Computer Audiophile Big Grin Nothing new from other UPnP servers. May I ask, when you tried foobar and JRiver... what renderer did you use for this?
Nothing new from Oppo either. I will ask them again after the release of their next firmware.

I use dsdmerge at the moment for merging DFF-files and creating a CUE sheet. It works via SMB and I have gapless playback this way.
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26-04-2013, 09:17
Post: #5
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(26-04-2013 07:30)Holzohr Wrote:  Hello Simon, I am the guy that has posted on Computer Audiophile Big Grin Nothing new from other UPnP servers. May I ask, when you tried foobar and JRiver... what renderer did you use for this?
Nothing new from Oppo either. I will ask them again after the release of their next firmware.

I use dsdmerge at the moment for merging DFF-files and creating a CUE sheet. It works via SMB and I have gapless playback this way.

I was using foobar2000 as renderer, with the foo_input_sacd plug-in component. Evidently, this isn't fussy about the MIME type of what's being streamed.

I know the LUMIN renderer works with MinimServer, and I know the Rendu works with JRiver, so it seems these aren't fussy about the MIME type either.

All this suggests to me that the compatibility issue is something that OPPO needs to solve, given that their player is currently incompatible with all media servers that stream DSD audio.
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27-04-2013, 05:41 (This post was last modified: 27-04-2013 05:43 by wappinghigh.)
Post: #6
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
Ok. Now I get it Simon. Thanks for taking the time to explain. We are close. *Very close* to getting the ultimate "All in one" with the Oppo 103 (and even better the Oppo 105 with it's direct DSD>multichannel analog outs and XLR stereo out and torroidal power supply..) This and Minimserver on a $250 NAS = a potentially very powerful and cost effective universal "every music file possible will play" type option... Smile
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27-04-2013, 15:28
Post: #7
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(26-04-2013 09:17)simoncn Wrote:  I know the LUMIN renderer works with MinimServer

I shall save money for LUMIN. That seems to be the best solution to me, apart of its price Confused First step is done with MinimServer installed on my NAS, in the next week I will get an iPad Mini (my very first Apple device!) and then I will try the LUMIN app.

Concerning the Oppo 103/105. I doubt it ever will be a "right" media renderer as long as it is not ready for gapless playback.
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27-04-2013, 20:40
Post: #8
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(27-04-2013 15:28)Holzohr Wrote:  ....in the next week I will get an iPad Mini (my very first Apple device!)

you wont regret it. Its a great device !
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27-04-2013, 23:31 (This post was last modified: 27-04-2013 23:44 by wappinghigh.)
Post: #9
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
^Gapless playback aside....before you get that LUMIN... Could the fussiness about MIME be something to do with availability of DOP and Async USB on the DAC?

The 105 is the *only* Oppo with these features.

Maybe the 105 will play these files back using MinimServer the way we want...?

Simon.. what do you reckon?...
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28-04-2013, 00:09
Post: #10
RE: DSD files and the Oppo
(27-04-2013 23:31)wappinghigh Wrote:  ^Gapless playback aside....before you get that LUMIN... Could the fussiness about MIME be something to do with availability of DOP and Async USB on the DAC?

The 105 is the *only* Oppo with these features.

Maybe the 105 will play these files back using MinimServer the way we want...?

Simon.. what do you reckon?...

Someone with a 105 would need to try this to find out. I can't think of any reason why these additional features would affect DFF and DSF streaming.
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