Post Reply 
 
Thread Rating:
  • 0 Votes - 0 Average
  • 1
  • 2
  • 3
  • 4
  • 5
BBC R3 Lossless Stream
28-07-2017, 15:34 (This post was last modified: 28-07-2017 20:12 by DavidHB.)
Post: #21
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 15:27)euphonia Wrote:  Could it make a difference that I have CodexPack installed on the Qnap?

As that was something I was going to try on my Windows machine, yes, that could be relevant. I'll see what I can do about installing codecs on my QNAP.

LATER. The CodexPak is only available for Intel models, and mine is ARM. And from what I can understand of its very convoluted documentation, FFMPEG does not appear to support MPEG DASH. Foiled again.

David
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 19:18 (This post was last modified: 28-07-2017 19:28 by ac16161.)
Post: #22
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
Unfortunately no joy on either my first-gen MajiK DSM or my new KDS/3, with or without flac:wav set in the transcoding. Both on latest firmware.

EDIT: would just add Minimserver is running on a Synology 416play. Regular AAC streams play fine via a .m3u playlist.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 20:19
Post: #23
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
Works on my KEDSM running 4.56.177 without transcoding and reports FLAC 48kHz/16 bits.

'troll
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 21:13 (This post was last modified: 28-07-2017 21:14 by DavidHB.)
Post: #24
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 20:19)Moomintroll Wrote:  Works on my KEDSM running 4.56.177 without transcoding and reports FLAC 48kHz/16 bits.

Welcome to this forum. You'll find a fair few of the usual suspects from over on the Linn forum here as well ...

The difference between those who find that the R3DASH stream works with Linn DS/DSMs and those who don't seems to be a function of which server platform they are using, and possibly therefore (I am guessing here) whether that platform has a relevant codec installed that MinimStreamer/FFMPEG can make use of. Actually what is needed is more than just the codec; it is a combination of the ability to use the MPEG-DASH (variable bit rate) streaming technique, plus the variant of FLAC in which the BBC stream is encoded (Cebolla's explanation at post #15 above refers).

How those capabilities happen to be installed on one platform and not on another I don't know. As I understand it, MPEG-DASH is more commonly associated with video codecs, but, as it is codec neutral, it can be used with audio codecs (FLAC in this case) as well.

David
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 21:23
Post: #25
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 21:13)DavidHB Wrote:  
(28-07-2017 20:19)Moomintroll Wrote:  Works on my KEDSM running 4.56.177 without transcoding and reports FLAC 48kHz/16 bits.

Welcome to this forum. You'll find a fair few of the usual suspects from over on the Linn forum here as well ...

The difference between those who find that the R3DASH stream works with Linn DS/DSMs and those who don't seems to be a function of which server platform they are using, and possibly therefore (I am guessing here) whether that platform has a relevant codec installed that MinimStreamer/FFMPEG can make use of. Actually what is needed is more than just the codec; it is a combination of the ability to use the MPEG-DASH (variable bit rate) streaming technique, plus the variant of FLAC in which the BBC stream is encoded (Cebolla's explanation at post #15 above refers).

How those capabilities happen to be installed on one platform and not on another I don't know. As I understand it, MPEG-DASH is more commonly associated with video codecs, but, as it is codec neutral, it can be used with audio codecs (FLAC in this case) as well.

David

Pleased to be here. If it helps, I'm running Minimserver on a QNAP 219P.

'troll
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 22:24
Post: #26
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 21:13)DavidHB Wrote:  The difference between those who find that the R3DASH stream works with Linn DS/DSMs and those who don't seems to be a function of which server platform they are using, and possibly therefore (I am guessing here) whether that platform has a relevant codec installed that MinimStreamer/FFMPEG can make use of. Actually what is needed is more than just the codec; it is a combination of the ability to use the MPEG-DASH (variable bit rate) streaming technique, plus the variant of FLAC in which the BBC stream is encoded (Cebolla's explanation at post #15 above refers).

How those capabilities happen to be installed on one platform and not on another I don't know. As I understand it, MPEG-DASH is more commonly associated with video codecs, but, as it is codec neutral, it can be used with audio codecs (FLAC in this case) as well.

David

MinimStreamer doesn't use FFmpeg for any MPEG-DASH processing. It does all the processing for this itself. The only use of FFmpeg is to transcode FLAC to WAV if this is specified in the stream.transcode property. It is possible that different versions of FFmpeg might differ in how well they can handle the unusual mid/side BBC variant of FLAC encoding.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 22:31 (This post was last modified: 28-07-2017 22:52 by DavidHB.)
Post: #27
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 21:23)Moomintroll Wrote:  Pleased to be here. If it helps, I'm running Minimserver on a QNAP 219P.

I'm not sure whether it helps or complicates the plot even further. If I'm not mistaken, your NAS has a Marvell (ARM) processor. That means, I think (but subject to correction) that, like my TS-131, it cannot run the QNAP CodexPack. So what is the difference between your NAS and mine? Huh

David

P.S. This post crossed with Simon's (above) which may put another spin on things.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 22:50
Post: #28
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 22:24)simoncn Wrote:  MinimStreamer doesn't use FFmpeg for any MPEG-DASH processing. It does all the processing for this itself. The only use of FFmpeg is to transcode FLAC to WAV if this is specified in the stream.transcode property. It is possible that different versions of FFmpeg might differ in how well they can handle the unusual mid/side BBC variant of FLAC encoding.

Thanks, Simon. This is helpful, I think.

As you see, I'm trying to discover why different Linn players running the current firmware are behaving differently. The most obvious differences between the systems seem to be on the server side, but I think you are suggesting that they may not be relevant. Are you saying that, if transcoding is not specified, the FLAC stream is sent to the DS 'as is', that is with the unusual encoding? This would imply that some players are handling the stream correctly, and some are not. If this is the case, we need to file a bug report with Linn sooner rather than later.

On a separate issue, have you any thoughts as to why even the standard BBC streams do not play on my ADSM when they are transcoded to WAV24? Could this be an issue with FFMPEG?

David
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
28-07-2017, 23:30 (This post was last modified: 28-07-2017 23:31 by simoncn.)
Post: #29
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
(28-07-2017 22:50)DavidHB Wrote:  As you see, I'm trying to discover why different Linn players running the current firmware are behaving differently. The most obvious differences between the systems seem to be on the server side, but I think you are suggesting that they may not be relevant. Are you saying that, if transcoding is not specified, the FLAC stream is sent to the DS 'as is', that is with the unusual encoding? This would imply that some players are handling the stream correctly, and some are not. If this is the case, we need to file a bug report with Linn sooner rather than later.

Yes, I am saying that. A further possible complication is that different BBC programmes seem to be transmitted with different forms of FLAC encoding.

Quote:On a separate issue, have you any thoughts as to why even the standard BBC streams do not play on my ADSM when they are transcoded to WAV24? Could this be an issue with FFMPEG?

David

It might be because MinimStreamer is sending an HTTP 200 response rather than an HTTP 206 response with Content-Range. There was a discussion on the Linn forum about this (see this thread).
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
29-07-2017, 09:08
Post: #30
RE: BBC R3 Lossless Stream
On my Linn DS (running Davaar 4.54.132), the lossless FLAC stream is playing but it doesn't play when transcoded to wav24. In both cases, MinimStreamer is sending an HTTP 200 response. If I play the 320k HLS stream, I see the same thing (aac plays but wav24 doesn't). It looks like there is some issue with the Linn firmware and WAV streams.
Find all posts by this user
Quote this message in a reply
Post Reply 


Forum Jump:


User(s) browsing this thread: 1 Guest(s)