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Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
11-07-2017, 09:38 (This post was last modified: 11-07-2017 10:01 by paultaylor.)
Post: #1
Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
Im having some issue understanding the interplay between displayRole and displayFormat. By default MinimServer has Artist.displayFormat={$artist$orchestra$conductor} in tagFormat, since for classical SongKong already treat artist as a meta field that is configured as performer,orchestra/choir/ensemble,conductor anyway I removed this.

[Image: minimconfig1.jpg]

But when I view a group sometimes it shows the value of the artist field and sometimes the value of the composer field, cant account for the difference.

[Image: displayRole2.jpg]

[Image: displayRole1.jpg]

I still have tagCustom set to Composer.displayRole={artist}, i have read the manual a number of times but I dont understand what this actually does in terms of affecting Kinsky, however if I remove it then sometimes the year shown instead of artist/composer.

[Image: displayRole3.jpg]
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11-07-2017, 10:28
Post: #2
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
The Composer.displayRole setting controls how composer information is sent to the control point as XML data. Control points vary in how they handle this because it is not defined as part of the UPnP specifications.

1) Most control points recognise composer information in the format <upnp:artist role="Composer">composer name</upnp:artist>. For these control points, the setting Composer.displayRole={artist} should be used.

2) Some control points don't understand the 'role=' attribute and misinterpret the above form as if it were <upnp:artist>composer name</upnp:artist>. This can cause the composer name to be shown as the artist name. For these control points, the Composer.displayRole setting should not be used.

3) A few control points recognise composer information in the format <upnp:author role="Composer">composer name</upnp:author>. For these control points, the setting Composer.displayRole={author} should be used.

Kinsky is in category 1, so you should be using Composer.displayRole={artist}. The reason for the unexpected display is probably the lack of an ARTIST tag on these tracks. In this case, Kinsky displays the composer (if available) or the date otherwise.

You can check the metadata that Kinsky is receiving by right-clicking on a track and selecting Details.
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11-07-2017, 11:00 (This post was last modified: 11-07-2017 11:31 by paultaylor.)
Post: #3
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
(11-07-2017 10:28)simoncn Wrote:  The Composer.displayRole setting controls how composer information is sent to the control point as XML data. Control points vary in how they handle this because it is not defined as part of the UPnP specifications.
Okay, so its purely to do with passing the composer as a field that can be displayed, completely separate from the index, okay I get that.

(11-07-2017 10:28)simoncn Wrote:  The reason for the unexpected display is probably the lack of an ARTIST tag on these tracks. In this case, Kinsky displays the composer (if available) or the date otherwise.

You can check the metadata that Kinsky is receiving by right-clicking on a track and selecting Details.
This doesn't seem to be the case all songs have the artist set, and you can see in this screenshot that Kinsky has received the (track)artist.

[Image: displayRole4.jpg]

Also note for this release there is one single movement work, so this has not been grouped and this correctly displays the artist value.

[Image: displayRole5.jpg]

I then tried adding Artist.displayFormat={$artist} to tagFormat this made no difference, the single track was still corecct and the grouping incorrect.

I then tried changing Artist.displayFormat={$orchestra}. The single track now displays orchestra as would be expected, but not no affect on tracks in grouping. But its not always wrong with grouping because I have another album with two groupings, tracks in first grouping is correct but not second grouping.
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11-07-2017, 11:48 (This post was last modified: 11-07-2017 11:53 by simoncn.)
Post: #4
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
I think this is a Kinsky issue and not related to MinimServer.

For the album with the surprising display, all track artists are the same and there is no AlbumArtist. Perhaps this is the combination that causes Kinsky to display the composer underneath the track title.

I looked at a few of my albums (track artists the same, album artist present or absent) and Kinsky is showing the genre underneath the track title. As your tracks don't have a genre, it seems that Kinsky shows the composer instead.
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11-07-2017, 12:24
Post: #5
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
It maybe a Kinsky thing, but actually all songs do have an albumArtist, it just not shown for the object.item.audioItem.musicTrack displayed when you get details for a track
When you get details for a group (object.container.album.musicAlbum) it shows an albumArtist and an artist field, but the value shown for albumArtist is actually the (track) artist.
When you get details for an actual album (object.container.album.musicAlbum) it lists Artist and AlbumArtist, but both values are set to the value of albumArtist.

I will try out adding genres, but without genres Kinsky is not consisently showing composer instead of artist, it is only showing for groups and tracks within groups, and then only sometimes.

I'll also try out Kazoo
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11-07-2017, 12:31
Post: #6
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
Hmm, i tried adding genres and rescanning it makes no difference on my display, do I need to reset something on Kinksy ?

[Image: displayRole6.jpg]
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11-07-2017, 13:14
Post: #7
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
Cannot get Kazoo to work just hangs on trying to connect to a nonexistent renderer.....
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11-07-2017, 13:17
Post: #8
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
I am using Kinsky 4.3.2 on Windows and I have confirmed that it displays the genre rather than the composer when both are present. If you are using a later version of Kinsky, this behaviour might be different.

As this is a Kinsky issue, you might get a better explanation for this behaviour if you post to the Linn forum.

Kazoo only supports OpenHome renderers. Without at least one of these on your network, it won't allow you to browse the server library.
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11-07-2017, 13:22
Post: #9
RE: Clarity on displayRole and displayFormat
(11-07-2017 13:17)simoncn Wrote:  I am using Kinsky 4.3.2 on Windows and I have confirmed that it displays the genre rather than the composer when both are present. If you are using a later version of Kinsky, this behaviour might be different.

As this is a Kinsky issue, you might get a better explanation for this behaviour if you post to the Linn forum.
I'm using 4.4.5.0, okay I will post there.

(11-07-2017 13:17)simoncn Wrote:  Kazoo only supports OpenHome renderers. Without at least one of these on your network, it won't allow you to browse the server library.
Ah right, thanks for clearing that up.
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